My alma mater has submitted to the state’s unconstitutional (or at least unconservative overreaching) mandate to advocate Christianity with public school resources by hanging a big “In God We Trust” banner in the high school lobby.
If only some kids with some Post-It notes would take action to reminder everyone in the school that using public resources to promote one specific religion is neither honest policy nor good Christianity:
IN our efforts to force our concept of GOD onto other people’s children in sacred public spaces of learning, WE are actually signalling to our political base rather than serving God by example. We TRUST that our efforts to indoctrinate children in violation of the Establishment Clause will go unpunished due to our religious privilege.
If ever a school display demanded some creative annotation, it’s the offensive display of an exclusive theocratic slogan masquerading as a national motto.
My dad, a long time Madison teacher, would have expolded at seeing this.
I’m guessing this all came about as a direct result of wingnuts stealing 2 Scotus seats and watching as McCTurtleface swaps empty seats in the judiciary for right wing ideologues whose only qualifcations appear to be right wing ideology.
Just for fun, 6th Circuit Court of Appeals says the Commonwealth of Kentucky must pay legal bills of gay couples not allowed marriage licenses by Kim Davis and she herself can be sued as well.
I sincerely hope that violates her religious freedumb, as she violated human rights in not following orders of the Scotus.
I read that, to comply with its state “In God We Trust” mandate, a school in Kentucky put up a huge photocopy of a dollar bill. It’s perfect because it complies with the dumb mandate and makes the ironic point that our society actually worships money. (And, presumably, it was cheap to do and required no licensing fee!)
Owen, I can just imagine your dad in my office exploding over this. It would be a fun conversation.
Vote The Overgodders Out!
Super sweet. You are right. A f7n conversation
The need to install signs like this tells me that Republicans need to be reminded, continually. We liberals carry the faith quietly.
I’ve heard of schools posting dollar bill images too. Kind of funny, in a fittingly sarcastic way.
I’ve never been able to find where in the bible it says, “Thou shalt enlist the government in forcing this religion onto everyone.” Can anyone help me?
Every one of these proclamations should have, down in the corner but big enough to be easily seen, the state law number. Then, any visitors would know it’s not the school or the student’s fault that such a thing exists.
Meh, public schools were created for indoctrination, so it seems fitting. I would ask what religion is being endorsed here, but that would just be opening a can of worms. But, it seems the Supreme Court is with me on that one “the Supreme Court wrote that acts of “ceremonial deism” are “protected from Establishment Clause scrutiny chiefly because they have lost through rote repetition any significant religious content””
I know plenty of people that use the word “god” all the time, but they would not consider their usage nor themselves as religious.
Why can’t public schools just stick to teaching and endorsing the religion of secular humanism? Hence, “sacred spaces of learning”.
Didn’t you teach there also? What happened there?
Joe, there is a difference between using public resources to indoctrinate children in one religion favored by the majority of legislators and teaching students an agreed curriculum.
I use the word “God” spontaneously, unthinkingly, and meaninglessly all the time, due to my cultural upbringing, but that’s very different from the deliberate act of the Legislature to misuse schools to promote one specific religion… or any religion.
Hey, Steve, do you have any comment on the actual issue? Do you feel the state has a proper role in indoctrinating students to believe in one particular religion? Do you support a Muslim community using public dollars to erect idols to Allah?
You keep wanting to play around with the personal, which is irrelevant. You can think and say all you want about my personally, but that only shows the paucity of your intellect and your inability to reason and speak about public policy issues. You may get your rocks off with personal attacks, but your comments are useless for figuring out how a democracy ought to conduct its affairs.
Owen, we need teachers of intelligence and conscience like your dad to do their duty as teachers and patriots and tell kids that displaying a religious message in a public school, at the behest of public officials, is wrong.
What do teachers at Madison HS and all other public schools in this state now say to Muslim kids, and atheist kids? “Sit down and shut up”?
Sit down and listen up sounds more like it.
You know, Muslims believe in the same God. Doubt you know that.
I’m with Joe on this one, what religion is it actually endorsing? It doesn’t specify the Christian God, Jewish God, Muslim God, Hindu god or gods, or God of indigenous peoples. There is no establishment of ” state religion ” here, it is open for interpretation. If your god is money, then that is what it can mean, no matter how shallow or misguided it may be. I know the point you are getting at, Cory, but I just don’t think the evidence is there to make it. I have to respectfully disagree with you here.
Wow. Check out the big brain on Steve. That’s a Pulp Fiction reference. Doubt you know that.
You’re right that some consider the Judeo-Christian God to be the same as the Muslim Allah. But some don’t. And since a religion is a belief system….. then I guess you don’t get to tell individual believers what is correct or not. That’s the whole “freedom of religion” thing.
Playing devil’s advocate, let’s assume that everyone agrees that the Muslim and Christian God is the same dude. So what? There are other religions, so you haven’t really taken a stance on this topic. You are just trying to be a smart ass.
Steve, do your friends know how big a crush you have on Cory? Are you married? If so, you should tell your wife.
Seriously, I’ve never seen anyone else here who was so totally enamored with Cory. You do know he’s a married man with 2 children and his wife is a wonderful woman? You should back off. You’re embarrassing yourself.
Steve, whatever the post is about doesn’t matter to you. Your comments are always all about Cory. It’s like your comments are just an excuse to visit with him.
Really. You should stop. 🙄 It’s embarrassing.
Debbo,
2 children?
I believe so. Why?
“Listen up to the vision of a few insecure theocrats who think they need government to intervene on their behalf to promote their religion” is more like it, Steve.
Debbo,
I was only tracking 1, K. Events may have transpired that I am not aware of.
Joe
Why is anyone discussing my private family life in this discussion of public policy?
The “God” in the motto now draped over and inscribed upon our school buildings is the Christian God. Check out its origins in the Civil War with a Baptist preacher who didn’t want America to go down in history as a heathen nation:
The God invoked is the Christian God, not Allah, not Gaia, not Buddha, not Zeus or Zoroaster or any other deity.
Also from Lienesch: “At the start, the crafting of the motto was an exercise in Christian nationalism.“
Also from Lienesch, the guy who stamped the motto on our coins was absolutely clear about its Christian meaning:
We all care deeply about you, Mr. H, and we want you to be happy and content. Plus ,the blogarazzi will always want pictures of you and your family.
The fact that supporters of the motto have to resort to word games—”‘God’ with a capital G, used as a proper noun, doesn’t mean the Christian God, heavens, no! Where does it say ‘Christian’?”—shows the inherent weakness of the motto as a national unifying statement. The motto cannot speak clearly to every American child. It should be replaced with E pluribus unum, the meaning of which is unambiguous. “In God We Trust” should only be displayed as I show it at the top, with the proper educational disclaimers to teach our children how some insecure Christians refuse to live up to their own religious principles as well as the tenets of inclusive democracy on which our nation thrives.
Cory,
I did not mean to offend, hence my direct message to you via another venue.
That being said, let us assume that you have at least one child in a South Dakota public school. If that assumption is true, then this encroachment of religion into The public schools is no longer an attack against the constitution, democracy, good order, etc. It now becomes a personal attack against you and your family, as it is now your child/children who are being indoctrinated.
Does that have bearing on this conversation? Perhaps. I think it is fair to say that whatever we feel or perceive a attack on our families, we take it personally, and are much more likely to the heavenly oppose such activities.
Sorry, that is supposed to say vehemently Opposed. Auto correct Freudian slip?
Sorry about the proper noun usage, cory, I’ll try to do better next time. Gimme a break.
It doesn’t matter what storybook you are silly enough to believe, statements about trusting god (your god, his god, her god, bible gods, koran gods, bhagavad gita gods, any god) don’t belong in schools. Plenty of people don’t believe in any god, and many who believe in a god don’t “trust” in it. The motto is dumb and so is this law requiring a dumb phrase to be plastered everywhere advertising the dumbness of the people who are in charge of the mottoes and the laws.
Everybody that truly believes in God, trusts in him… it’s clear that you don’t, I’ll pray for you, even if it offends you. Peace.
It doesn’t offend me if you pray for me, just like it wouldn’t offend me if you asked a Magic 8 ball whether or not you should diversify your stock portfolio. No impact on me. Have at it.
But, back to the constitution of our great country…”Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof…”
The intent of phony kristian sharia law pushers was to get god back in the schools and they and their followers can make all the excuses they want how this isn’t about religion. Just remember the commandment about bearing false witness. Not that it really has any meaning for phony followers of Rev Donald the Pathological Liar in Chief of kremlin West.
Just moar living in denial by white wingnuts.
It all depends on how you interpret establishment… I would argue if our house and senate passed a law, signed by the governor, establishing Christianity as the state religion… that is establishment, not what we are seeing here. If it gets struck down by the Supreme Court, I may think otherwise. Why can’t I cry foul that the school is prohibiting my exercise of religious freedom if they decide to take it down. Where do we draw the line? No Jesus shirts, no Buddha necklaces, no flip flops cuz that’s what Christ wore. Everybody being butthurt by everything is getting old, and it’s showing. Did you watch the Democratic Socialist convention, they couldn’t even get a meeting called to order without half the audience being triggered. You honestly think these people can run a country? Better get used to Trump for another 4 years. GOD help us!
John, I agree that you and everyone else should be free to wear your god shirts and sandals and pray to your saviors as often and as passionately as you would like. That’s religious freedom.
Requiring our public institutions to offer free ad space for your message is not religious freedom, it’s a religious mandate, and that’s “respecting an establishment of religion.”
I also agree with you that the current trend of people being easily offended is ridiculous and exhausting, but this is the friggin first amendment, man! This isn’t about fringe gripes from a vocal and crazy gaggle of snowflakes. Religious freedom was a primary impetus for the founding of our country! This law is an embarrassment.
John, it has been written….you don’t pray in our schools, we won’t think in your churches.
Religion does not belong in public, taxpayer funded schools and it has nothing to do with anyone’s religious freedumbs. You absolutely feel the need to pray, go to church. You have the right to moment of silence in school. You can pray or plot to overthrow the world , whatever.
Praying is as insidious as saying the pledge of allegiance every damn day. Just how many times does one have to grovel in front of something no one can prove exists?
I am shocked by how much South Dakota’s Governor and the White House do that I have to counterprogram in children. Kristi Noem and Donald Trump make parenting harder when we have to say with ever more frequency, “Don’t act like our leaders. They’re wrong, and here’s why.”
Kristi Noem is wrong because she wears her religion like flashy jewelry and tries to force everyone else to wear it as well. It’s as if she thinks she gets to Heaven or wins special Divine favor if she just writes “God” enough times or incants his name over and over. What a cheap and paltry religion, thinking that salvation comes from slogans and displays of piety.
John, I’m not offended by the prayers of others. I am offended by publicly funded displays of one religion’s piety forced upon all of our children as statements of fact rather than what they really are: political and theocratic posturing.
John, your slippery slope to flip-flops and religious necklaces totally misses the point that Ryan tried to emphasize: we aren’t talking about your personal freedom to express and live your faith. We are talking about what the state expresses, in the name of all citizens. You are under no obligation to avoid expressing religious views that differ from and declare false the religious views (or absence thereof) of others. The public school system is. The public school system cannot use tax dollars to put up a sign that favors members of one religion and makes children who don’t belong to that favored religion feel like they are not a part of our pluralistic democratic community. Look beyond yourself and look at the obligations of the government and community as a whole, in the public sphere.
From Pennsylvania, 3rd circuit court ruled atheists cannot give legislative invocation because they don’t believe in a higher power, or some such bull.
https://thehill.com/blogs/blog-briefing-room/news/459200-federal-court-says-atheists-can-be-blocked-from-delivering
Madison HS Subjects Students to State-Mandated Religious Indoctrination—Time for Instructive Annotation!
Then, right out of the blue, they get 11 inches of rain dumped on them for biblical punishment. What incontrovertible truth.
Come now, Mike, we don’t believe in such a tit-for-tat God. My Gaia is a cold, uncaring mistress unswerved by prayers or peccadillos.
Cory, are you referring to “Mother Nature” obeying the Laws of Nature as humankind is distorting them?
Google “Project Blitz” for information about this coordinated effort of various conservative right-wing religious groups to promote “In God We Trust” signs and religion classes in public schools. They write the model legislation and fund efforts to get it passed in various states. They have been successful in a number of states. South Dakota is but one of their successes.
grudznick is also not offended by others who quietly pray in the dark to magical beings, however anybody who tries to jam their “god” down my maw, like Mr. Howie tried to do, offends me greatly. Keep your god out of my government, or I will put my government into your god with a livid vengeance. grudznick ended Mr. Howie’s political career by outing his overgodding. I’m just sayin…