Trump Refuses to Promise Peaceful Transition of Power

Donald Trump has uttered many statements over the last fifteen months that sounded like the words that would end his candidacy. Tonight we heard the ultimate such sentence.

Fox News moderator Chris Wallace asked the Trump if he would join his running mate in affirming that he would “absolutely accept the result of the election.”

Trump said, “I will look at it at the time.” Pressed by Wallace to commit to the principle of the peaceful transition of power, Trump said, “I’ll keep you in suspense.”

Hillary Clinton’s immediate response was, “That’s horrifying.” She knocked Trump for crying “rigged” every time things don’t go his way: in the primaries, in court, even in the Emmy nominations—at which point, Trump interjected, “Should’ve gotten it.”

The audience laughed, but Clinton pressed. “This is how Donald thinks. It’s funny, but it’s also troubling.”

That Donald Trump stands in a Presidential debate and grouses about not winning an Emmy tells us how small and brittle of a man stands before us.

That Donald Trump won’t promise to accept the result of the Presidential election and support a peaceful transition of power tells us how dangerous Donald Trump is to democracy. Donald Trump’s failure to offer that basic affirmation of democracy overrides any reason he may offer to elect him to public office.


148 Responses to Trump Refuses to Promise Peaceful Transition of Power

  1. Donald Pay

    Total disqualification. Let’s all practice, “Madam President.”

    Here’s an interesting tidbit about the Trump organization and EB-5, which might be of interest to South Dakotans:

    http://www.wsj.com/articles/trump-branded-project-developer-in-austin-seeks-to-tap-immigrant-visa-program-1476911830

  2. Don Coyote

    While Gore may have conceded to Bush on December 13, 2000, countless Democrats refused to accept that George W Bush had won the election. Please, take your conceit and park it elsewhere.

  3. Hillary Clinton looked and sounded Presidential tonight. Trump looked and sounded Trumpian, which is the opposite of Presidential. She helped herself immensely tonight. She closed the deal with undecided voters tonight.

    Trump’s performance in the final debate will be remembered solely for his laughable claim that “Nobody respects women more than I do.” followed up by his rude interruption calling Hillary, “such a nasty woman.”

    That’s a wrap folks! Trump is going to return to his whining that the election is rigged. The debate was rigged. That it’s everybody else’s fault he’s losing. After tonight there’s no comeback coming for him. He blew it. It’s all over but the whining.

  4. Don Coyote

    @Donald Pay: Of course you neglect (as does cah) to note that EB5’s chief sponsor was Senator Ted “USS Chappaquiddick” Kennedy and was passed by a Democrat controlled Congress. So are you inferring that Trump somehow broke the law? Maybe just maybe the Democrats just passed a crappy law.

  5. When Gore lost to Bush by a few hundred votes in Florida and a 5-4 Supreme Court decision he showed class and conceded. He did not fan the conspiracy flames.

    When Thune lost to Johnson by 524 (?) votes he showed class and conceded. He did not fan the conspiracy flames.

    Trump is doing everything he can to tear this country apart, and it looks like he’s going to continue trying to de-legitimize American democracy in an attempt to make himself look like a victim rather than a loser. But he’s just a loser. His new DC hotel is failing, by the way. (Notice how I borrowed his phraseology?) That is the next Trump business to declare bankruptcy next year. He’ll blame that on Hillary too.

  6. Curtis Price

    Gore’s concession (when the facts then and now clearly show he won the election) was one of the most courageous things I’ve ever seen on the political stage, anywhere. The country has paid dearly for the Supreme Court’s short-sighted error — a decision that will go down with Plessey as one of the nations great judicial mistakes. RBGs dissent will be required reading for a long time.

  7. Coyote, just for you my man from north of the Yucatan, thanks for making him a post turtle, ya did good “Examining a 75 year old farmer, the doctor struck up a conversation with the old man. Eventually the topic turned to Trump and his role as GOP Nominee for President. The farmer said, ” Well, as I see it, Donald Trump is like a ‘Post Tortoise’.”

    Not being familiar with the term, the doctor asked him what a ‘post tortoise’ was. The old farmer said, “When you’re driving down a country road and you come across a fence post with a tortoise balanced on top, that’s a post tortoise.” The old farmer saw the puzzled look on the doctor’s face so he continued to explain. “You know he didn’t get up there by himself, he doesn’t belong up there, he doesn’t know what to do while he’s up there, he’s elevated beyond his ability to function, and you just wonder what kind of dumb ass put him up there to begin with.”

  8. Don Coyote

    The only reason Al Gore conceded was because he saw the handwriting on the wall and knew that if he contested the Florida results any further that the election would have ended in the House where he would have lost. But his base never conceded and still to this day claim Bush’s illegitimacy (as you do) that the election was handed to Bush by the Supreme Court. Try again Rorsch.

  9. Next year is going to be a lousy one for Trump. The GOP Party is going to disavow him. His golf courses are going to lose business. His DC hotel is going bankrupt. The Trump University suits will garner headlines for months. Melania will divorce him before he has a chance to dump her for a younger woman. Everybody with money to invest now knows better than to invest in one of his projects. Even Kellyanne Conway will quit returning his calls. Trump is going to have a very lonely and unhappy existence going forward. Donald Jr. and Eric will have a hard time finding any business partners for their own ventures. Ivanka and Melania will be the only ones to emerge from Donald’s sh** pit with any dignity.

  10. Don Coyote

    @Jerry: Just as you do, I have no idea what you prattle on about. But keep trying.

  11. Don Coyote

    Next year Hillary is going to tip over and Tim “Krazy Dude” Kaine will assume office for 2 minutes until the 25th Amendment is invoked and Speaker Paul Ryan takes over.

  12. Pure fantasy Coyote. Between Kaine and Pence, Kaine is the sane one – though Pence is a better debater.

  13. Don Coyote

    Pence won’t be in play and the Democrats could have gotten a better performance out of a potted plant in that debate.

  14. Darin Larson

    Trump is so stupid that he thinks that not committing to accept the election results is a brilliant move.

    I can’t wait to hear from Pence and Conway when they are asked about Trump’s answer. Dodge and weave. Dodge and weave.

    Oops, Conway actually ran away from an interviewer from CNN on this question already tonight.

  15. Trump will hire Kellyanne Fitzgerald to be on his tee vee show for the next 4 years to entertain dummies while slimming Clinton. He will bring the old gang back together again, Drudge will finally get a newer fedora, Laura Ingraham will keep the doo and work on her snarl, this is gonna be entertaining to watch people get tired of their same old crap and start reading books again. How bout you coyote, remember how to do that? It goes like this, from left to right and then down the page. Be careful now take baby steps. Maybe limit yourselves to something you can comprehend, perhaps a couple paragraphs to start. Republicans, got to retool them to clear the barnacles after all these years of doing nothing but screwing up the country. I’ll miss President Obama, best damn prez in my lifetime so far, that is for sure. But I will welcome President Clinton along with the progressives that have lined up with her. Don’t worry Coyote, she’s got this.

  16. Tonight, Hillary reminded me why I trust that she can [wo]manhandle the biggest d!ckheads that cross her path.

    She will slay this dragon. I never doubted her or her team for a second vs. Trump – yet witnessing the intelligent voice of reason out-compete plausible (at best) BS before my very eyes has been more divine than I even thought it could be.

    I don’t care what the polls say, people like me are now, very personally, 30% more pumped about Hillary than they were before this debate.

  17. Trump certainly is worthy of some kind of award, but it’s not an Emmy. It’s the M-E award.

  18. It really says a lot about the human race that these two candidates are the best we could do for Presidential candidates. Well, I guess it’s mostly not the voters fault when you’re in such a rigged corrupt system as our American government is.
    Embarrassing.

  19. I actually kind of feel sorry for Trump’s children to have such a mean-spirited man for their father.

  20. Coyote, like Al Gore, I accepted the outcome of the 2000 election. But unlike Donald Trump, no one in this discussion is running for President. Your effort to defuse the argument fails. Presidential candidates have millions of followers; they have a unique obligation to tell those followers that we will play this game fair and square, accept the results, and allow a peaceful transition of power.

    Is Trump inciting his followers to post-election violence? Dare we start chanting “Lock him up”?

  21. Trump’s refusal to accept the outcome of the election is the top story on the webpages of the New York Times, the New York Post, the Washington Post, CNN, Fox News, Politico, The Hill, the BBC, Le Monde….

  22. Darin Larson

    No one in the storied 240 year history of the USA has ever refused to honor our Democratic traditions of the peaceful transition of power before a presidential election. Coyote would mock anyone else for bringing up Gore if the shoe was on the other foot. Gore didn’t say the election was rigged before the election. Gore didn’t say before the election that if he didn’t win the election was a fraud. Gore didn’t say before the election that he would not honor the election results. Bush v. Gore happened because of the extraordinarily close election which rested on the results in Florida coupled with problems in the vote counting process in Florida. This was all after the election and Gore honored the Supreme Court’s decision. Equating Trump’s pledge not to honor election results before the election with Gore’s issues after the election took place is preposterous.

    Trump is a tin-horn dictator in search of a country to rule. Let’s tell him to move on to his next fraudulent business deal and leave our American Democratic traditions alone.

  23. mike from iowa

    Wingnuts like Coyote haven’t conceded the 2008 election or the 2012 election to the Black Kenyan Usurper.

    Dumbass dubya didn’t win in 2000. A rigged, right wing nut job activist Scotus handed him the reins of power.
    Please, take your conceit and park it elsewhere.

  24. mike from iowa
  25. mike from iowa

    Feel sorrow for neither Drumpf or Coyote. They have brought this upon themselves.

  26. “While Gore may have conceded to Bush on December 13, 2000, countless Democrats refused to accept that George W Bush had won the election. Please, take your conceit and park it elsewhere.”

    I’ve seen this analogy a couple times, and it is utter bull. There is a vast difference between arguing over a close popular vote and the manner of counting them in a battleground state and saying the only way I can lose is because it is rigged before the damn election day. Talk about intellectual dishonesty. If you want to talk about the whining from some members of the democratic party post-SCOTUS decision, I am with you. But Gore conceded. Stop lying, Don.

  27. The Minneapolis Star Tribune calls Trump’s statement a “stunner“:

    Threatening to upend a fundamental pillar of American democracy, Donald Trump refused to say Wednesday night that he will accept the results of next month’s election if he loses to Hillary Clinton. The Democratic nominee declared Trump’s resistance “horrifying.”

    …Trump’s assertions raise the prospect that millions of his supporters may not accept the results on Nov. 8 if he loses, thrusting the nation into uncharted territory. Free and fair elections, with the vanquished peacefully stepping aside for the victor, have been the underpinning of America’s democratic tradition since the country’s founding 240 years ago.

    The Republican National Committee immediately disavowed Trump’s statement. There is no evidence of widespread voter fraud, and election officials across the country have denied and denounced Trump’s charges [Julie Pace and Lisa Lerer, “Debate Stunner: Trump Won’t Say He’ll Accept Election Result,” Minneapolis Star Tribune, 2016.10.20].

    Time for Thune and Daugaard to reverse themselves again.

  28. As Dicta says, Gore fought to make sure the results were counted correctly, but when the SCOTUS decided the results, Gore accepted them immediately. Trump could have made that promise last night and left room for Gore-like litigation to decipher hanging chads. Trump did not. Analogy to Gore falls; Trump is disqualified.

  29. Just to be clear, wasn’t the whole birther movement nothing more than not accepting the results of Obama’s election? Not accepting the results of a presidential election (and actively working to discredit those results) is not new to Trump.

  30. O: ding ding ding! Correct!

  31. Jay Williams shares our shock and disgust and wonders why John Thune doesn’t:

    In perhaps the most astonishing moment in the history of televised Presidential debates, Donald Trump refused to affirm he would accept the results of the election. Trump has displayed his ignorance of how our government works many times before, but his statement in the debate this evening went beyond ignorance. By questioning our basic democracy, he not only disqualifies himself for the office of the President of the United States, he approaches sedition. John Thune remained committed to voting for Trump after his sexual predator remarks. What can Trump say that will cause John Thune to stand up and show the political courage to reject Trump? Will Thune accept the results of the election [Jay Williams, press release, 2016.10.19].

  32. NOem, Thune and Daugaard will not reverse themselves on this because they have the same group think as Trump. Daugaard has shown his real hate agenda by disallowing the Medicaid Expansion to help those here in our state. NOem has voted to gut women’s rights, as shown recently with the new poison pill the haters added on to the must pass Defense spending bill, leaving our front line soldiers at risk. NOem and Thune both supported the devastating government shutdowns that caused so many problems here with the Atlas Storm that killed thousands of head of livestock, all out of hate. Thune is just tall, so he sees it all and votes according to whoever the pocket filling lobbyists tell him to and never questions the hate that his party supports. When you see these three, you are actually seeing Donald J. Trump in all of his racial and gender hatred. We should not kid ourselves into thinking otherwise.

  33. Troy Jones

    I wish I had a nickel for all the times posters here referred to GWB as an illegitimate President.

    Your “outrage” is further without standing because I’ve yet to hear any of you calling for the head of Clinton’s campaign manager who said having a driver’s license and attesting one is a citizen (even if one is not) should result in one getting ballot to vote.

    Your hypocrisy is palpable.

  34. mike from iowa

    Thanks, Troy.

    http://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/1d547a4005e1ddaaaf1a8774a3db39cb4e144c2bf52b2a721bdfdf637e4ce0a3.jpg?w=480&h=409

    Dumbass dubya was given the job by five deranged wingnuts twisting court precedence into pretzels and claiming it was a one time only deal.
    Scotus is the final arbiter of law, not presidential appointments.

  35. Darin Larson

    Troy Jones, Let me help you out. We are talking about all the Republican and Democratic nominees for President in the history of the USA. Never before has one of the major party nominees announced that they will not accept the results of the election unless they win.

    Your idiocy is palpable if you can’t understand that this is a HUGE deal.

    Of course there are people that don’t accept that their favorite candidate didn’t win or that they were robbed in some conspiracy theory. That is not the same as a major party candidate themselves announcing that they will not honor the results unless they win and claiming that the system is rigged. Go take some civics classes if you don’t have a clue.

  36. Troy, GWB was the legitimate president BECAUSE Gore said so. Do not confuse political grousing with substantive challenges to legitimacy. Even those who harbored the idea that GWB stole the White House, that did not ascend to open rebellion or obstruction of GWB’s carrying out the responsibilities of office; it was more an FYI footnote to history. Trump and his birther sedition constituted an active challenge and obstruction to Obama carrying out his responsibilities of office.

  37. “I wish I had a nickel for all the times posters here referred to GWB as an illegitimate President.

    Your “outrage” is further without standing because I’ve yet to hear any of you calling for the head of Clinton’s campaign manager who said having a driver’s license and attesting one is a citizen (even if one is not) should result in one getting ballot to vote.

    Your hypocrisy is palpable.”

    1. GWB was my commander in chief when I served, and I served him proudly. He was a legitimate President, and I have never said otherwise.

    2. Your point about Clinton’s campaign manager is a non-sequitur, and you know it.

  38. Donald! Thanks! That’s twice now this year that we have anti-immigration Trump relying on Chinese EB-5 investors to fund his projects. (See Trump Tower story in March.) Add his purchase of cheap steel and aluminum from China, add his praise for Putin and call to dismantle NATO and leave allies hanging, and we have a President who seems determined to undermine American strength and appease our biggest geopolitical rivals.

    Throw in refusing to accept the results of a democratic election, regardless of who wins, and we have a recipe for disaster.

  39. Troy, go find us those examples so you can cash in that coupon.

    My point stands: Trump’s statement last night is as disqualifying as if Al Gore or George W. Bush had said such a thing at their final debate. Al Gore accepted the results. Donald Trump will not make that simple promise.

  40. The Los Angeles Times does a good job of explaining the difference between Gore 2000 and Trump 2016:

    1. “Gore never questioned the election results before the voting concluded.”
    2. Gore conceded on election night when the networks called Florida for Bush.
    3. Gore withdrew his concession only after Tim Russert went “uh oh” and the networks corrected to say Florida was too close to call.
    4. Florida law required a recount.
    5. “Gore sought hand recounts in a handful of counties; Bush sued to stop them. Pictures of elections officials scrutinizing paper ballots filled the airwaves, and a legal battle ensued. Ultimately, Bush took the matter to the Supreme Court, which stopped the recount. Gore said he disagreed with the decision but conceded the race.”

     
    Trump’s statement last night, declining to promise to accept the results of the election before the election takes place, fanning false fears of election-rigging, is very different from anything that Gore, Bush, or any other past Presidential candidate has done in previous elections.

  41. Speaking of power. There has been a lacking of discussing climate change in the debates. So I thought that I would toss in that China is now on the road to surpassing its own goals. We are slipping and falling on our collective arse’s while a do nothing congress, that has the likes of NOem and Thune voting to support this lack of interest, continues to let China eat its milkshake. South Dakota could be involved very heavily in the future of this planet, if we had congressional input from these two right wing nuts. https://grist.org/climate-energy/7-signs-that-china-is-serious-about-combatting-climate-change/

  42. Porter Lansing

    By claiming election fraud, Don Trump is dog whistling his followers to political obstruction, as Republicans did vowing to do whatever it took to make Obama look bad. We Liberals don’t need a dog whistle. Turning the Senate and House Blue and giving our progress a chance is the mission. It’s a twenty day war Democrats and it’s on now!

  43. Good on you Mr. Lansing

  44. Richard Schriever

    Coyote – Trump is NOT going to win the popular vote (which Gore did by over 2.5 MILLION votes). Not even close.

  45. Bill Fleming

    Tsk. Troy knows the difference. I think he’s just torked because his team doesn’t have a candidate. Can’t say as I blame him.

  46. Bill Fleming

    Tsk. Troy knows the difference. I think he’s just torked because his team doesn’t have a candidate. Can’t say as I blame him.

    (LOL. tried to post this and it went into moderation because I spelled my own name wring. Doh. I give up. **slaps own forehead**)

  47. What would happen if President Obama refused to step down in protest of Trump’s refusal to accept defeat? I would bet that coyote would support Obama on this one.

  48. After 7+ years of President Obama, 43% of GOP Party members believe he’s a muslim:

    http://www.politifact.com/punditfact/statements/2015/nov/23/arsalan-iftikhar/do-59-percent-americans-believe-barack-obama-musli/

    and 41% of GOP Party members believe that he was not born in the USA:

    http://www.mediaite.com/online/new-poll-shows-that-41-of-republicans-still-dont-think-obama-was-born-in-the-u-s/

    Trump has been a big part of that misinformation/de-legitimization campaign against President Obama. Now he’s actively setting the stage for 4 years of deluded GOP Party members believing Hillary stole the election. If 40+% of GOP Party members believe from day 1 that Hillary stole the election, how will GOP Party congresspeople as slaves to their wingnut base voters ever be able to work with the executive branch for the good of the country?

  49. Many ignorant nominees have refused to concede and we still have the country and the states running. Who cares if there are some diehards and there may well be those Jade Helm’rs that think blankly. The police will address that as they did in North Carolina during the hurricane when some dude went all Jade Helm on them. http://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory/north-carolina-trooper-kills-man-floodwater-confrontation-42726159 Even though the police union endorsed Trump does not mean that they will not serve and protect the public. Trump is clever enough to understand that it is all about the money. He cannot have his chance at the real prize of an Emmy with the United States in disruption, bad for business.

  50. Darin Larson

    Same old loathsome Donald Trump. This is familiar territory for him. He called for “revolution” and a “march on Washington” in 2012 after Obama was projected to be the winner of the election. He asserted via a twitter rant that the 2012 election was a “total sham and a travesty. We are not a democracy!”

    http://www.cnn.com/2016/10/18/politics/donald-trump-rigged-vote-twitter-2012/index.html

    He is deplorable.

  51. Don Coyote

    @Richard Schriever: “Coyote – Trump is NOT going to win the popular vote (which Gore did by over 2.5 MILLION votes). Not even close.”

    And when did the popular vote become relevant in electing the President? I guess I didn’t get the memo on that.

  52. coyote-“While Gore may have conceded to Bush on December 13, 2000, countless Democrats refused to accept that George W Bush had won the election. Please, take your conceit and park it elsewhere.”

    npr reported 537 votes separated gore’s lead from bush but the supreme court stepped over the fla. sup ct. and stopped the recount.

    we had a good civics lesson watching dems and repubs slug it out in the courts then. trump encourages violence at his rallies now. please tell me when Hillary slaughters him, he wont pout and start a violent protest.

  53. dicta- “1. GWB was my commander in chief when I served, and I served him proudly. He was a legitimate President, and I have never said otherwise.” I salute u sir. The point is bush was inexperienced (no experience) and feebly led a country into disaster relying on an unschooled turd bloosum and wyomings finest, dick cheney. if u think cheney helped, I can’t help u. he is the definition of neo conservative. trump has no experience leading a government and shows by his daily action his complete inability. he will surround himself with people just like bush did who will lead the country to disaster.

    lets see, republicans did it once. now they want to do it again. and what the hey, if they loose, obstruction worked (short term)? cool. when we get the senate, the supreme court will be reconstituted and the world may eventually move toward peace. big picture.

  54. oh, and dicta and troy, it is completely plausible that bush was illegitimate because the fla supreme court action would have led to a gore victory, but a republican supreme court took the matter away from us and gave it to bush. republicans are very good at winning elections, gerrymandering, limiting voter registration ect, and out lawyering a tied election, politicizing courts, military spending over social security/medicare. republicans play the ultimate hard ball. treason. (thunes letter with 47 senators to Iran; 01/09/09 republican obstruction dinner while Obama danced). I feel good that dems do not have the lack of values that allows republicans to win their litany, their history of scorched earth efforts.

  55. Roger Cornelius

    Troy,
    A simple yes or no answer will suffice, do you agree with Trump’s assertion that he may not accept the results of this election?
    If by some freaky accident Trump wins the election will he still believe the election was rigged in his favor.

  56. Darin Larson

    Coyote says “And when did the popular vote become relevant in electing the President? I guess I didn’t get the memo on that.”

    Donald Trump thought it was relevant when he went on his twitter rant the night of the 2012 election:

    “The phony electoral college made a laughing stock out of our nation. The loser one (sic). . . . “[Obama] lost the popular vote by a lot and won the election. We should have a revolution in this country!”

    http://nymag.com/daily/intelligencer/2012/11/trump-is-election-nights-most-unhinged-goper.html

  57. Trump may not be wrong; the voting system may indeed be “rigged.”

    There’s been some pretty intensive investigation into the 2016 presidential primary voting and something very aberrant happened with voting results in the Sanders/Clinton race.

    http://www.hollerbackfilm.com/electoral-system-in-crisis/

    These aren’t crackpots sounding the alarm – they’re folks like an Edward R. Murrow award-winning journalist, statisticians from George Washington University, and U.C. Berkley, etc.

    That said, Trump’s loss isn’t likely to be because the system is rigged; he can lose it without any help.

    But we need to acknowledge there’s a problem, especially with electronic voting.

  58. I am strongly considering joining the ranks of the Democratic Party as they seem to be the only party that is consistently for law and order. I remember way way back when republicans would run campaigns on law and order (war on drugs was the big dog whistle) and on national security laying claim that they were the best suited to handle such things. How can you have the gall to preach of law and order as well as national security when you want to destroy the very foundations of democracy?

  59. Darin Larson

    Trump vows to “totally accept the results of this great and historic presidential election IF I WIN.” (EMPHASIS ADDED)

    http://www.cnn.com/2016/10/20/politics/donald-trump-i-will-totally-accept-election-results-if-i-win/index.html

    Trump Jr. is so arrogant that he said that Donald Trump becoming president would be a “step down” from his current gig. The Trumps think he is doing us a favor by running for president and lending us his talents for deciding when to declare bankruptcy and expanding our vocabulary for lewd talk and the objectification of women.

  60. Roger Cornelius

    Darin,
    CNN Breaking News just sent out an email relevant to your link.
    Trump dug himself into a giant hole last night and rather than find a way out, he just keeps on digging.
    Trump’s ignoring his vice president and campaign manager’s advice about accepting the results of the election she that Trump listens to no one except Trump.
    That is dangerous. Will he ignore the advice of generals, military advisors
    and others that are sworn to keep our nation secure?
    Again, Trump doesn’t believe in teamwork, he believes in Donald Trump.

  61. In South Dakota, we use paper ballots. Pretty cool way of doing the vote. It might be the old way, but it is the best way to prevent errors in electronic voting. We should do that nation wide makes more sense than to worry about machines going down or getting hacked.

  62. Above the punditry, do we all understand how truly dangerous it is for a candidate to fan the flames of “revolution” in this way? Start by making the claim that the election is rigged – that the will of your followers will be supplanted – not by a fair democratic (small ‘d’) system but through some nefarious means. Rile this group up. (Remember this is a group that has forwarded the idea of “Second Amendment solutions” to problems.) Then lose the election. That loss then becomes the evidence of the “fix.” Where can this go? Trump has plotted a corse for disaster that has the real potential to go far beyond words. This is not fun and games anymore.

  63. “And when did the popular vote become relevant in electing the President? I guess I didn’t get the memo on that.”

    Hopefully in time for the 2020 election. The issue of scrapping the electoral college is ripe. Let’s do it!

  64. Darin Larson

    Roger, Trump has already stated that he will ignore the Geneva Convention with regard to torture and order our military to torture in violation of the Geneva Convention. He has stated that he will ignore every adviser on nuclear nonproliferation and spread nukes freely throughout the world. He knows more about ISIS than the generals do.

    o, has laid out the serious consequences that could ensue based upon Trump’s dangerous claims. Trump has doubled down on his claim that the election is rigged and if he doesn’t win that the election is illegitimate. How many crazies out there are going to grab a rifle and look to make good on Trump’s threat for revolution if Trump does not win? Trump and his supporters are worried about the threat from immigrant terrorists to our country while fomenting a greater threat to our country in the form of a hate movement with calls for insurrection that could drive people to commit violent acts.

    If you take Trump at his word, he is an authoritarian in waiting that is not fit to be president under any circumstances. Can you imagine him with the power of the presidency behind him and virtually unlimited federal resources to carry out his personal vendettas? He has been involved in over three thousand lawsuits when he was spending his own money to fight them. Imagine if his actions were defended by the federal government and he didn’t have to spend his own money defending unconstitutional activities. Does anyone doubt that he would start a war to distract the country if things were going badly for him as president? If he was humiliated on an issue, would you doubt that he would drop a nuke on the middle east?

  65. I think that we understand the dangers of people like Trump and those like the Bundy’s who claim that the system is rigged against them. We understand the 2nd amendment as well in all its applications. It seems to me that most thoughtful people would be able to understand that the risk of death to further a billionaire’s pocket book, does not make to much sense. If that same thoughtful crowd would then see the dangers of a civil conflict while our military is fighting and dying to protect the democracy they think of destroying, also should make them consider what is at stake. We just lost a serviceman killed in action in Northern Iraq as just reported.

    That is why we pay a police force to serve and protect us from each other at home. When folks like the Bundy clan decided to do what they have done, it did not end well for one of them in the snowy ground of Oregon with the rest of them rounded up and put in jail for trial. We must always be vigilant of the dangers of these types of haters while asking ourselves why elected officials support the hate they bring out? If you have not already voted, ask yourself why NOem and Thune would support anarchy in its fullest while asking that same government for disaster money? The game they play is just a game until someone looses an eye.

  66. mike from iowa

    http://juanitajean.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/10/Screen-Shot-2016-10-20-at-11.10.07-AM.png

    Drumpfpence newsletter today. I think somebody has his recent(last night history) all wrong.

  67. mike from iowa

    Snowflake Tundra Tart sez Drumpf won the debate last night hands down because he talked of policies and HRC did not. Delusional Deplorable Dizzy-Witch.

  68. Donald Pay

    Cory,
    This is great. My daughter had a hand in this EB-5 story. My daughter saw an ad for a marketing position for an EB-5 operation in a Beijing publication. She knows some WSJ journalists. Bingo.

  69. Porter Lansing

    Millenials & Young Voters … When Madame President Clinton initiates her plan to make college/trade schools cheaper and to help you pay off your outstanding education loans, South Dakota Republicans will surely refuse it, as they did with the Medicaid expansion, cheating worthy people entitled to healthcare insurance assistance from their piece of our national progress. Just to make HRC look bad and act stubborn they’d harm the state’s youth? Certainly! They have a track record of exactly this kind of political selfishness. Do you want to used as an example set by the election’s losers? Voting straight down-ticket Democrat and getting on board the progressive train is your future’s best bet in November. Education is going to improve and Republicans way aren’t on your side.

  70. Roger Cornelius

    mike,
    Sarah Palin is “such a nasty woman”.

  71. Mr. Lansing, the good news is that our young people can then move out of state to get their education. Once the scales are brushed from their eyes, they will then have to ask themselves why the hell would I want to live in such a backwoods place that pays squat for my work and knowledge. The Medicaid Expansion would be the result in hospital closings and doctors figuring out that they would be better off getting out of here as well. In the meantime, the locals will continue to vote red because of freedom don’t ya know. Or else, the voters can change all of that starting in a couple of weeks.

  72. Troy Jones

    Roger,

    This is your question: “A simple yes or no answer will suffice, do you agree with Trump’s assertion that he may not accept the results of this election?”

    I’m not sure what I’d be saying yes or no to so I can’t answer. I will make a general statement: I think either candidate has the right to pursue legal remedies if they believe there is evidence of voting irregularities. I think that was what Trump was saying- he would keep his options open to pursue those remedies if he has evidence. If he was saying he would not accept Hillary as President if she wins just because, I don’t agree with what he said.

  73. mike from iowa

    Can we agree Drumpf Bosworth rilly needs a white coat intervention?

  74. mike from iowa

    Had Drumpf meant legal remedies he would have threatened to sue anyone and everyone. He has the best lawyers doncha know?

  75. A voter has to be indecent and/or a fool to vote for Trump. This election is quite the test of South Dakota conservatives integrity. Normal, decent, Americans are going to elect Hillary Clinton no matter how much whining and complaining Trump does. He’s a joke, and only one conservative friend of mine is voting for the bastard.

  76. Roger Cornelius

    Troy,
    “I think any candidate has the right to pursue legal remedies if they believe there are voting irregularities. I think that is what Trump was saying-he would keep his options open to pursue those remedies if he has the evidence”.
    C’mon Troy, Trump didn’t even say any such a thing nor did he remotely hint at it.
    His exact words were I’ll keep you in suspense and he reaffirmed that comment in a rally today.

  77. Roger Cornelius

    Troy,
    I should have mentioned that I did like your last sentence that you don’t agree with Trump for the comment last night if he can’t provide evidence of voting irregularities.
    And, welcome to DFP where you can freely discuss last night’s debate. As usual your mentor Powers at the Dump Site refuses to post on the debate.

  78. Douglas Wiken

    Halloween and voting aren’t too far apart. Guess that is appropriate when the GOP has a headless horseman running as a presidential candidate.

    My memory may be wrong, but the voting did not actually stop in Florida and the results after all indicated Gore would have won a recount had it occurred. Also, Florida prevented thousands of ex-cons and other from voting in Democratic districts. Can’t remember the Florida Sec. of State’s name, but she was deeply involved in rigging that election and may have been rewarded with a government post. Not sure about that however.

    All the Florida mess indicates is that having a Democratic President in the White House and a Democratic majority in Congress is critically important in getting reasonable Supreme Court justices instead of political hacks with a record of attempts previous to court tenure of restricting voting in their home states.

  79. Don Coyote

    @Adam “A voter has to be indecent and/or a fool to vote for Trump.”

    And the Democrat candidate is such a paragon virtue isn’t she? Bwahahaha!

  80. mike from iowa

    Katherine Harris, Mr Wiken.

  81. mike from iowa

    HRC’s only sin is she is smarter than all wingnuts combined. Unless you want to say wingnuts are incompetent and that is HRC’s fault, too.

  82. Actually it is paragon of virtue. But what is the point of pointing something like that out to a trumper, who knows. Yes, Adam is absolutely correcto mundo on this statement and you are as well Coyote. Good work from you both.

  83. Tell yourself whatever you want, but know for sure that reasonable people all over the world will be shaming your demographic for decades to come. Trumpers are fringe radicals – waaay outnumbered and outgunned by the brains behind this great human experiment.

  84. Darin Larson

    Coyote– Clinton was wearing white at the last debate because, compared to Trump, she is a paragon of virtue, decency, hope and truth in the world. You elected a mean-spirited, thin-skinned, narcissistic, misogynistic, orange clown to be the Republican nominee to lead the free world. Own it.

  85. Don Coyote

    @Jerry: “Actually it is paragon of virtue.”

    Yes I know. However there is no way to edit posts on DFP. Sorry I offended your inner grammar Nazis.

  86. What a joke—-so let’s have a joke—Why did God create Nascar? ——————for people who do not understand professional wrestling!

  87. Roger Cornelius

    Donald Trump is getting booed at the Al Smith Dinner.

  88. Don Coyote

    @Darin Larson: Tell that to the Haitians the Clinton Foundation ripped off. I’m sure they’ll agree.

    “In January 2015 a group of Haitians surrounded the New York offices of the Clinton Foundation. They chanted slogans, accusing Bill and Hillary Clinton of having robbed them of “billions of dollars.” Two months later, the Haitians were at it again, accusing the Clintons of duplicity, malfeasance, and theft. And in May 2015, they were back, this time outside New York’s Cipriani, where Bill Clinton received an award and collected a $500,000 check for his foundation. “Clinton, where’s the money?” the Haitian signs read. “In whose pockets?” Said Dhoud Andre of the Commission Against Dictatorship, “We are telling the world of the crimes that Bill and Hillary Clinton are responsible for in Haiti.” ”

    http://www.nationalreview.com/article/437883/hillarys-america-secret-history-democratic-party-dinesh-dsouza-clinton-foundation

  89. Roger Cornelius

    Donald Trump’s Foundation was shutdown by the state’s attorney general for not following the laws of New York.

  90. Oh, you did not offend me whatsoever. I just was not sure if you were trying to make a sentence about the Pantheon in Homer and just spelled it incorrectly. Hillary and Homer both start with the letter H, so I was stepping up to help you step up. A grammar Nazi? Hardly, just an Independent thinking of going Democrat which is just the opposite of Nazi. I owe it all to the trumpers like yourself that have turned this mild mannered feller into a party animal, we shall see, but it keeps looking promising.

  91. coyote, what is a dinesh? Sounds felonious to me

  92. Don Coyote

    @jerry: “what is a dinesh?”

    A Sanskrit name meaning “day lord”. Hindus use the name for the sun. Don’t give up your day job jer.

  93. So then Dinesh D’souza would be the author. Tell me, wasn’t he punished for illegal political schemes for money? I think kind of a felon, right?

  94. Mike, you’re link showing how Trump funded O’Keefe is absolutely shocking – yet makes perfect sense.

    Trump is the scumiest amateur hack wannabe politician I can conceive might ever exist in this world.

    Once you vote Trump, there’s no going back. You’ll be a second class citizen overnight, and if a state gives itself to Trump, it will be seen as a second class state within these United States of America.

  95. mike from iowa

    Drew McCormick, She didn’t do it.
    Written Aug 3
    According to reports, it is, unsurprisingly, not very accurate. The New American, which is not a liberal friendly site, despises it for “twisting history,” and then goes on to cover a multitude of mistakes made in the movie – so many that they only get up to about 1900 before running out of steam.

    The Christian Post, likewise excoriates it: 5 Historical Omissions in Dinesh D’Souza’s Film ‘Hillary’s America’

    As a matter of fact, other than the National Review, who’s editor stars in the movie, I can’t find a single positive review of it, and most damn it for numerous factual errors. With a rating of 4% on Rotten Tomatoes, it is pretty bad.

    Note that this is the product of convicted felon Dinesh D’Souza, who has a history of producing shoddy and factually challenged PR pieces.

  96. Darin Larson

    Coyote, the Clinton Foundation has spent millions on Haiti and billions on other charitable causes around the world. The Clintons continue to give millions to their foundation. Trump hasn’t donate to his foundation in years. He has used his foundation to pay off his legal settlement debts and purchased artwork of himself for his own business use.

    This is the best retort you can come up with, Coyote? Even your attempt to impugn the Clinton Foundation is outmatched by Trump’s own corrupt foundation.

  97. coyote: “@Adam “A voter has to be indecent and/or a fool to vote for Trump.”
    And the Democrat candidate is such a paragon virtue isn’t she? Bwahahaha!”

    I only see bwahahahahah on natl blogs/media which feature hidden conservative, neo, denier bloggers who seem to think that sound equates to what trump seems to think “absolutely”, “trust me”, “really, really”, and “every body knows”, “howz that hopey changey thing gion’ for yah?” ad infinitum (to the shallow depth of of the “very, very, smart” Wharton grad’s brain).

    I loved it, trump demanding of Chris Wallace, a veteran journalist, “have you seen it, Allepo, have you seen it, do you need a signed document?” The complete lack of self awareness that he is in the deep end. Slaughter. Trump. Nov. 9. My prediction.

    A leading feminist properly characterized COE Trump’s put down of strong woman Hillary, interrupting her to call her “a nasty woman”, today on NPR and when I find the cite there yah go. But Trump started calling strong women “nasty” when they took him down back in march. http://www.rawstory.com/2016/03/watch-trump-whines-about-nasty-questions-as-hes-annihilated-on-air-by-nprs-cokie-roberts/

    dead meat. trump. that public comment had the same weight , ironically as Bill’s pointing to the camera “ahh never had sex with THAT WOMAN!” trump calls Hillary “her”, “that woman” through out the debates.” pig. as coyote would howl “bwahahahah”. I know, it sounds like the bleating of a thirsty lamb. could comment coyote. love it. love it. republicans. jfc :)

  98. The republican has always refused the peaceful transition of power. Always. The most recent was Obama from the first day even. The republican plot was to make him a one term prez. We had a helluva time doing it, but we elected him again much the their chagrin. The republican did everything in their power to kill legislation that would help the country in order to refuse the presidency of President Obama. They said he was born in a foreign country called Hawaii, denounced his veteran grand father and his white mother as unfit. Hell, Trump even bought Obama’s estranged half brother to the debate! Naw, denying the results of elections is in the republican dna and has been for some time.

  99. Roger Cornelius

    When all is said and done and Hillary wins the election, it won’t matter one damn bit if Trump refuses to concede the election.
    The Constitutional process of electing Hillary as president will have been completed with Trump yelling from the top of Trump Towers and nobody listening.

  100. Funniest twitter line I’ve seen today: Be the nasty woman you want to see in the world. :)

    Then the Nasty song from the 80s was being played again by Janet Jackson. Trump is a trend setter!

  101. Relax about the ‘yote everyone. He’s already acknowledged that his boy Trump is going to lose. He’s just going through the stages of grief.

  102. Darin Larson

    Trump’s national political director has quit his campaign with just 18 days before the election according to CBS news. Trump blaming everyone but himself for his huuuuuge loss?

  103. Doug,

    Your memory of the Bush-Gore recount in Florida is not accurate.

    Gore conceded. He retracted his concession because the margin was within the mandatory recount margin. We had a recount. He lost the recount. He did not accept the results of the recount and took it to the Supreme Court.

    By any definition of “not accepting the results of the election,” Gore did not do so or he wouldn’t have filed the suit with the Supreme Court. And, while Gore accepted the decision, he and many Democrats continued to call Bush an illigitmate President.

    The “outrage” against Trump’s statement is the epitome of hypocrisy.

  104. Roger: “When all is said and done and Hillary wins the election, it won’t matter one damn bit if Trump refuses to concede the election.”

    I disagree. On paper it doesn’t make a difference in that Clinton will be sworn in and given her keys and parking tag to the White House back, but her ability to govern and unify a nation is seriously compromised – compromised by the behavior of the Trump hate machine. I think Jerry is on point about the attempt to delegitimize Obama’s presidency by the right, now Trump takes that even further (and yes, Clinton will face the “normal” opposition from the GOP as well).

    I hope I am over-worried, but seeing how some of Trump’s rallies have gone, seeing the level of hate and anger stirred up, seeing the amped up rhetoric of a “stolen” election, I think there are alt-right folks who will not handle this loss well, and will feel the need to take a stand in some real way against this created “enemy” in the White House.

    My hope to mitigate some of this governance obstruction is that Trump is so toxic that Clinton gains some down-ticket allies to back her up in the House and Senate.

  105. Darin Larson

    Troy, what a crock of crap you are trying to peddle here. For at least a month, Trump has been claiming that the voting is rigged and the only way he could lose is if the election is stolen from him. He once again refused to say that he would honor the election results three weeks before the election. You are being an idiot trying to conflate Trump and Gore.

    Gore didn’t say that he wouldn’t accept the results of the election before the election. It was only after Florida had all the problems with its count and recount that Gore took the matter to court. The Florida Supreme Court on a matter of state law agreed with Gore’s challenge.

    No one asked Trump to sign away his right to contest an election if there was voting irregularities that could impact the result like in Bush v. Gore. You and I both know that Trump is setting this up to cushion his fall from grace as he loses this election “Big League.” Keep defending your village idiot and watch your senate majority go buh bye.

  106. Troy Jones

    Darin,

    1) Gore wasn’t asked the question before hand. Trump was.

    2) As I said, I didn’t like Trump’s answer because it wasn’t clear. But, your “outrage” is the epitome of hypocrisy.

    3) Your assertion you know his intent is beyond your pay grade.

    4) The symbiotic relationship between the 4th Estate (which is supposed to be unbiased) and the Clinton campaign does fundamentally make the election process rigged. If it was reversed, we would be seeing the “outrage” you express on Trump’s statement. Again, hypocrisy.

  107. mike from iowa

    2) As I said, I didn’t like Trump’s answer because it wasn’t clear.

    Good thing he clarified himself saying he would accept the results only if he wins. Clear enough for you, Troy?

    Darin deserves a raise in pay grade for stating the obvious.

  108. Troy, don’t you think that Trump was asked that question (and Gore was not) reveals something about each man? It is not a standard question to ask a candidate (in my memory), but it NEEDED to be asked of Trump.

  109. mike from iowa

    Why is the 4th estate supposed to be unbiased, when wingnuts Mother ship-Fake Noize- is so obviously (and admittedly) biased against Libs?

  110. In a democracy, why on earth would you have to ask a nominee if they will concede the race if they loose? The only reason is when the nominee screams weeks before the election that it is rigged. Back to the drawing board for you Mr. Jones

  111. mike from iowa

    http://talkingpointsmemo.com/livewire/al-gore-2001-overruled-protests-florida

    Al Gore acting with dignity and honor. A couple words not in Drumpf’s vocabulary.

  112. I can hear Trump saying ‘ the election was a disaster’. “A total rigged disastah” for days on end after election day.

  113. If anyone caught the Catholic charity dinner last night on TV, it seems even Archbishop Dolan preferred the company of Hillary over obnoxious Donald. The Archbishop was in deep conversation with Hillary and his back turned from Trump. Hilarious! Body language, indeed.

  114. Troy Jones

    Jenny,

    Afterward Cardinal Dolan described his seat between them “the iciest place on the planet.”

    I don’t that is a good reflection on either of them.

  115. Don Coyote

    @Jerry: “The republican has always refused the peaceful transition of power. Always. The most recent was Obama from the first day even.”

    Once again you fail Poli Sci 101. The concept of a loyal opposition is critical to a republican form of government as it allows the minority a voice; whether that voice influences the debate, takes part in the decision making or stands in opposition. One can remain loyal to the country and the Constitution without having to show allegiance to the governing class. The First Amendment guarantees this.

  116. Douglas Wiken

    Trump was asked because he had previously indicated election was rigged, etc, etc. Hillary had never said anything suggesting such a question of her would have made any sense.

    Trump is an egotist who just can’t accept that he might get stomped into the dust of history by a female.

  117. Douglas Wiken

    This is an interesting review of the Florida election mess. By some counting methods, Gore won. By other counting standards, Bush won.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Florida_election_recount

  118. Troy Jones

    Doug,

    Just to make sure the record is clear, the counting methods that showed Gore won were:

    1) A state-wide review of all ballots which was never pursued by Gore which he chose not to do.
    2) Were conducted during 2001 (long after Bush had taken office) by a group hired by newspapers to do a post-election analysis. it was not conducted under the procedures of Florida law (one from each side determining the vote together and putting disputes in a pile to be latter assessed).
    3) The methodology used by the group later came under criticism as they deemed about 1,000 ballots “spoiled” because the voter appeared to put pressure on the Nader spot but punched Gore or put pressure on the Buchanan spot but punched Bush. That standard was declared a too strict standard for deeming the intention was unclear.

  119. Roger Cornelius

    We should have known that Donald Trump would say he wouldn’t concede or accept the election results because the election was rigged anyway.

    Remember when during one of the first republican primary debates when FOX “News” debate moderator, Megyn Kelly, asked the candidates if they would accept the party’s nominee and only Trump refused to step forward.

  120. Troy thinks we live in The Matrix; thinks no one actually remembers the Al Gore thing enough to correct his revisionist version of history.

    But more insane than anything, drawing relationships between the Al Gore and Donald Trump is such a stretch that it demonstrates moral and/or mental handicap.

  121. Bill Fleming

    Isn’t the point here that Bush won because Gore said so? (So easy to get lost in the weeds with this stuff.) Brother Troy, did you vote for Trump yet? Or ain’t you sayin’? ;-)

  122. mike from iowa

    Algore Hiss stopped Dems from initiating more challenges to the outcome of the 2000 debacle.

  123. Coyote, I will give you the republican leader in his own words https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W-A09a_gHJc As a both sides do that sort of denial of election results as you now blather about, kindly provide the same from a Democratic leader or for that matter, any ole Democrat saying they will deny the will of the people to block any kind of legislation put forth by the popularly elected president.

    In 2003, when President Bush declared a mandate to force the purchase of an unfunded Medicare prescription drug plan, it was the opposition party called Democrats that did all in their power to make the thing work. Kindly show where this has been reciprocated regarding President Obama.

  124. Troy Jones

    Bill,

    Bush won because first the Florida recount/canvas said he won Florida and ultimately a majority of the Electoral College. Al Gore could have protested until today (which he does on occasion) and it wouldn’t make a bit of difference. The loser in the election doesn’t have any say in who wins or loses.

    I have not yet voted. Not pleased my choices are:

    A cad who recklessly says things with little connection to reality and in whom I have insufficient confidence will deliver on issues of importance to me.

    A person who recklessly says things with little connection to the truth, protects a cad and in whom I have insufficient confidence in what she really believes or will actually do.

    The sad reality is 25% of the voters support Hillary, 22% support Trump, 3% support Johnson, 2% support Stein and 48% of the voters are choosing between candidates they don’t like. Frankly, I’m with the 48%.

  125. mike from iowa

    For the halibut- the NRA is using a video made by O’Keefe to tie Wisconsin Dem Feingold with HRC in wanting to take your guns.

    BTW- O’keefe’s outfit sez they won’t release original tapes showing Dem ops weren’t planning voter fraud. The one guy was fired and the other resigned. Even w/o original tape it should be patently obvious tapes are edited heavily.

  126. mike from iowa

    Speaking of being rigged, it is a conspiracy. Here are the first 2 lines from Roger Whitaker’s song-The Last Farewell- There’s a ship lies rigged and ready in the harbor
    Tomorrow for old England she sails

    Damn libs are everywhere.

  127. bearcreekbat

    Troy, maybe you can help me. With all the attacks on Hillary by her political enemies I thought there might be substance to some of the allegations. This lead me to right wing attack articles and criticism to determine whether there was any documentation for these repeated dishonesty allegations. I have not been successful in finding any meaningful documentation that would make her more dishonest than any normal human being. Mostly I find name calling, pejorative labeling, attacks on her looks, her personality, her smile, her clothing, her hairdo, with all sorts of negative statements about Hillary’s character, but there seems to be no meat there that shows her to be a candidate or human being that deserves to be labeled more “dishonest” more than any person.

    People call her “dishonest.” While she has actually made some statements that are considered half true and some pants on fire, when comparing her statements to the statements of all the other presidential candidates fact checkers have consistently concluded that her statements have been more honest than either Bernie or virtually all of the Republican presidential candidates. So what is the standard we need to use to judge this female candidate? Is it different than you would use to judge a male candidate? What particular evidence can you point me to to support your statement that she “says things with little connection to the truth,” especially when comparing her to male politicians?

    And are you really hesitant to vote against her because she stood by her husband instead of divorcing him?

    And what is it in her 30 year public record that leads you to say that you “have insufficient confidence in what she really believes or will actually do?” Isn’t her record pretty consistent throughout her public life?

  128. Porter Lansing

    Hear, hear BCB. They call her mistakes – lies. They call pushing the envelope – crime. Jealous women are jealous of her success. Republicans hate strong women ’cause she’s “hip to their tricks”. There’s no there , there. Republicans don’t like ANY Dems so not liking HRC means nothing. It’s just losers lament.

  129. republican talking point with no substantiation: crooked Hillary, Hillary lies. Not a lie Troy. We could take everyone of her lies and debunk them, but this was trump’s most recent bold assertion hissing, yes hissing, her, she, she lies, she lied, crooked Hillary, last night at the roast. the guy has nothing but buffoonery, as does the rest of the republican party that is now fatally wallowing like you grasping at “48%” undecided which you reluctantly have been relegated to. bullsheit dflag is flying troy.

    http://www.latimes.com/politics/la-na-pol-open-border-fact-check-20161019-snap-story.html

  130. troy, “Bush won because first the Florida recount/canvas said he won Florida and ultimately a majority of the Electoral College. ” I don’t think this ancient history is even accurate for your spun thought process. if you’d like me to prove it to you, I can invest some time. but otherwise, just stop. you are lucky u live in a deep red state where you can have soft rational for your core values.

  131. Porter Lansing

    Perfect, Leslie ??

  132. Porter how are down ticket elections looking a mile high across the state?

  133. Porter Lansing

    Leslie … Our Blue Senate seat is safe. I’m personally working for Morgan Carroll in her attempt to remove a house seat from a military desk jockey who aggrandizes himself as a war hero when he spent a tour safely in the green zone working on Iraqi election procedures. Rep. Mike Coffman is being properly linked to Don Trump. It’s a toss up but the former State Senate President and strong advocate for women’s rights is probably going to win.

  134. Porter Lansing

    Mr. Jones …. You’ve been spreading around those favorablility/likeability numbers as some sort of equivalence between HRC and Don Trump. If you choose to shoot that duck then use updated numbers. Here’s Real Clear Politics latest poll from 9/28 – 10/20.
    ~ I read it as, Sec. Clinton has a normal favorability for a Washington politician (Troy, your Paul Ryan has a favorability of 33.5%). Don Trump’s rating is not good. History shows that when not vying with a man for power in politics Sec. Clinton has an exemplary job approval rating and surely that will be the case for the next two terms. It’ll be tough to live up to President Obama’s level but with Democrats behind her (contrary to your assertion, Troy) she’ll be a stellar leader and an example to young girls everywhere.
    REAL CLEAR POLITICS
    Clinton: Favorable/Unfavorable
    RCP Average 9/28 – 10/20
    FAVORABLE 43.1%
    unfavorable 53.0 % –
    spread 9.9%
    TRUMP: Favorable/Unfavorable
    RCP Average 9/28 – 10/20 —
    Favorable 35.4%
    unfavorable 61.1% –
    spread 25.7%

  135. Darin Larson

    Troy, I have been busy, but I’m getting back to your responses:

    “1) Gore wasn’t asked the question before hand. Trump was.”

    So how do claim the two scenarios are the same? Trump said he would not honor the results before hand. No one has ever said that. Gore never said that he would not honor the results before the election.

    “2) As I said, I didn’t like Trump’s answer because it wasn’t clear. But, your “outrage” is the epitome of hypocrisy.”

    So every media source, political scholar and historian that said this was unprecedented, dangerous and an affront to our democratic traditions was merely being hypocritical? A lot of neutral people thought this was a big deal. It wasn’t just partisan Democrats.

    “3) Your assertion you know his intent is beyond your pay grade.”

    Are you talking about Trump’s intent? He has made his intent clear by his statements that the voting is rigged, if he does not win the election was stolen from him, and he will accept the election results if he wins.

    “4) The symbiotic relationship between the 4th Estate (which is supposed to be unbiased) and the Clinton campaign does fundamentally make the election process rigged. If it was reversed, we would be seeing the “outrage” you express on Trump’s statement. Again, hypocrisy.”

    You are equating unbiased with neutral or equal in their coverage. The media has been hard on Trump, not because they are so biased for Clinton, but because Trump is such a rotten candidate. Do we really need to recite his failings? Suffice it to say he is the worst major party candidate in modern times. You don’t really expect the media to just gloss over all his failings, do you? The man is running for president, for goodness sake! And in case you didn’t notice, there has been gobs of coverage of Clinton’s issues.

    If I am so off base here, why are there tons of main stream Republicans that cannot stomach supporting Trump? I haven’t heard of any prominent Democrats supporting Trump or refusing to support HRC.

  136. The GOP Party is now running ads in New Hampshire that assume Clinton will win – saying vote for Kelly Ayotte to be a check and balance in the senate.

    The Democratic Party should start running ads in all close senate races saying vote for the Democrat to put the senate in Democratic hands and have a split congress to be a check and balance to the radical GOP Party House. That’s a winning argument I hope the Democrats will use.

  137. Porter Lansing

    Outstanding. Rorschact ???????

  138. Roger Cornelius

    Porter,
    Might I suggest you go to Nate Silver’s 538.com for his complete analysis of the election.
    You can sign up for his daily email which is very insightful. I visit the site regularly to see the daily shift in not only the presidential race, but also the senate races.

  139. Porter Lansing

    Thanks, Roger. I’ll do that.

  140. Roger, Ror, everyone else, I’m wondering: when the polls show a candidate is doomed, does turnout drop? If Trump’s loss looks inevitable, will the GOP be able to rally voters (as they are trying in NH) to vote for Senators to check President Clinton, or will that inevitable loss at the top of the ticket depress GOP turnout and hurt GOPers downticket? Or does an inevitable Clinton win also depress Democratic turnout and leave downticket results the same as they would have been in a tight Presidential race?

  141. Porter Lansing

    I see women on Facebook and Twitter who’ve never been outgoing about politics engaged at a high rate. They’re very happy to be helping elect the first women President and it would be hard to stop them from voting. I see Republicans retreating from social media and why wouldn’t you? We have all mail in voting and that’ll stay the same turnout. It’s just about impossible for anyone to throw a ballot into the trash. In a really, really red state how’s it look?

  142. dicta-study this map “Mosul battle in one image”. this is the price paid electing a deeply flawed presidential candidate.

    “GWB was my commander in chief when I served, and I served him proudly”. you were serving dick cheney and his host of neo-cons that took advantage of bush’s inexperience. Saying “bring it on” was like Miley Cyrus introducing the world to twerking. shallow.

    http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2016/10/21/world/middleeast/mosul-peshmerga-isis.html?hp&action=click&pgtype=Homepage&clickSource=story-heading&module=second-column-region&region=top-news&WT.nav=top-news&_r=0

  143. troy-I really think u continue to spin the bush v. gore election debacle. “don’t make me come out there, shelly…” as a young male relative likes to say, meaning if I have to go back and document the facts to enlighten you (I taught the case to college students bitd) I am not going to be very happy with that misuse of time u created. It is now American political history, and is fairly easy to get an unbiased professional rendition of the facts, even for you. No offense, but others shouldn’t have to straighten out an old story you decide to tell.

  144. for example- “the [Supreme] Court actively prevented the completion of a halted state recount, never having ruled on the merits either of the challenge or the election and never having adjudicated the validity of Bush’s certification or Gore’s request for a recount. Instead, the Court selected the next President of the United States in the absence of a completed election—the ultimate political act.” wiki, for now

  145. If I may leslie, I would ask you to consider this of what Mr. Dicta said “1. GWB was my commander in chief when I served, and I served him proudly. He was a legitimate President, and I have never said otherwise.”

    As a uniformed member of the military, our oath is basically to follow orders from the Commander in Chief to defend the Constitution. In Mr. Dicta’s case, the Commander in Chief was President Bush, period. He, like the rest of us, did not have a choice in that matter. For the record, I served under President Richard Nixon. What may be proven flaws in each of these Commander in Chief’s, they were still our commanders and as such, they were the legitimate elected officials we followed to defend our oath to the Constitution.

    The battle for Mosul is now being waged in such a way that our President Obama is utilizing our allies to carry the battle with American military in support. For some time now, we have heard the echo chamber of republican politics berating our president for his lack of tactical involvement. Thanks for showing that President Obama has got this once again. This kind of action, by the folks involved in the entire theater, shows what real leadership is all about. I cannot think of a better way to use regional resources in such a place as the Middle East and in particular, the battle for Mosul.