Senator John Thune and Senator M. Michael Rounds joined 45 other Republican Senators in signing an open letter to the leaders of Iran to, as explained by letter instigator and freshman Senator from Arkansas Tom Cotton, make sure Iran’s leaders “understand America’s constitutional system.” The real intent is to undercut the active negotiations of the Executive Branch with a hostile foreign power. While not treasonous, this political ploy transparently and offensively degrades foreign policy into a partisan spat.
The Iranians recognize empty propaganda when they see it:
Whether the Republican letter might undercut Iran’s willingness to strike a deal was not clear. Iran reacted with scorn. “In our view, this letter has no legal value and is mostly a propaganda ploy,” Mohammad Javad Zarif, Iran’s foreign minister, said in a statement. “It is very interesting that while negotiations are still in progress and while no agreement has been reached, some political pressure groups are so afraid even of the prospect of an agreement that they resort to unconventional methods, unprecedented in diplomatic history” [Peter Baker, “G.O.P. Senators’ Letter to Iran About Nuclear Deal Angers White House,” New York Times, 2015.03.09].
Vice-President Joe Biden says the letter from Thune, Rounds, et al. is disrespectful and dangerous:
In thirty-six years in the United States Senate, I cannot recall another instance in which Senators wrote directly to advise another country — much less a longtime foreign adversary — that the President does not have the constitutional authority to reach a meaningful understanding with them. This letter sends a highly misleading signal to friend and foe alike that that our Commander-in-Chief cannot deliver on America’s commitments — a message that is as false as it is dangerous,” Biden said in a statement released by the White House.
“The decision to undercut our President and circumvent our constitutional system offends me as a matter of principle. As a matter of policy, the letter and its authors have also offered no viable alternative to the diplomatic resolution with Iran that their letter seeks to undermine,” he added [Igor Bobic, “Joe Biden Goes Ballistic On Senate Republicans: Iran Letter Beneath ‘Dignity Of An Institution I Revere’,” Huffington Post, 2015.03.09].
When Senator Thune and Senator Rounds trot out their mealy-mouthed denials that they aren’t trying to torpedo executive foreign policy, refer them to these words from Senator Cotton:
“The end of these negotiations isn’t an unintended consequence of congressional action. It is very much an intended consequence. A feature, not a bug, so speak,” Cotton said in January, speaking at a conservative conference hosted by the advocacy group Heritage Action for America [Ryan Grim, “Senator Who Organized Letter to Iran Has Said He Wants to Sabotage Negotiations,” Huffington Post, 2015.03.09].
The President of the United States is negotiating with a foreign power. Senator John Thune and Senator M. Michael Rounds are interfering with that negotiation. Senator Thune and Senator Rounds need to stand down and return to serving their constituents, their oath, and their country.
Christianists like Thune and Rounds begging for the End Days: just another reason South Dakota deserves Armageddon.
Stupid state.
South Dakota Democrats: go out and buy the best guns and as much ammunition you can afford, practice, and prepare to defend yourselves and your families from your Republican neighbors.
You poor bastards.
Traitors! is what the headline is for this paper. http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2015/03/10/nydn-blasts-iran-letter_n_6836392.html
When do you think South Dakota’s media will tell the truth about our illustrious senators? Thanks to this blog, the word get out. No thanks to them, the lame stream South Dakota media, about hiding the hideous truth of these treasonous actions.
Wingnuts are changing the “greatest deliberative body” of all time to the greatest deliberately obtuse bunch of dingbats ever. Contact special ops and let’s have their extraordinary rendition of where did all but seven of the wingnut sinators go?
Rounds and Thune ought to be ashamed, and be shamed, for signing this letter. But they’re not, and they won’t be, for they are proud right-wing politicians. Though neither of them ever served in the military, they will be at the front line of those politicians advocating sending your sons and daughters (the less-than-one-percenters) back to war in the middle-east. Yet, South Dakotans keep electing these Republican hacks. Shame on South Dakota voters, too.
“Suppose you are an idiot, and suppose you are
a member of Congress. But I repeat myself.”
— Mark Twain
Legislators both on both the state and federal levels call into question their mental competence with acts that demonstrate a propensity for petulant, adolescent vandalism. A Tufts professor of international politics makes this point which 47 senators did not grasp:
“This is an important point that often gets lost in the partisan rancor. The Iran negotiations are not a bilateral arrangement between Iran and the United States, but a P5+1 negotiation with Iran. If a deal is reached, it’s a deal that has the support of all the permanent members of the UN Security Council plus Germany.
“Now I doubt that Tom Cotton et al would weep much if, in undermining an executive agreement, they would tick off, say, Russia or China. But our NATO allies in Europe are another question entirely.”
http://www.washingtonpost.com/posteverything/wp/2015/03/10/a-coda-to-the-
Obama Derangement Syndrome.
Or South Dakota takes care of its village idiots by electing them to legislatures.
By changing the name of the state, here is a good post to put on facebook to show the extent of these two bozoheads actions against world peace. http://www.dailykos.com/story/2015/03/10/1369776/-The-Senate-Doesn-t-Want-to-Hear-About-the-Letter-to-Iran
By having constant war, the senators are stealing the very future of our state and of her citizens, by the great expense of blood and treasure.
Anyone think this dually applies to this situation?? http://blogs.reuters.com/great-debate/2015/03/01/netanyahu-invite-is-a-symptom-of-boehners-grudge-match-against-the-u-s-constitution/
Few things have incensed me recently as much as Rounds’ actions on this matter, and I voted for the guy. Stupid, stupid grandstanding.
I see even my buddy Mr. Woster is throwing down on this one, albeit in a far more gentle and humble way that I have (will a little help from Mark Twain, of course.) I suppose I can adjust my attitude enough to ask our good Senators for a reasonable explanation, and promise to listen to it graciously. That kind of takes all the fun out of it, but hey, why should we let Woster be the only adult in the room. :-)
http://blog.keloland.com/politicsinkeloland/2015/03/10/open-very-short-letter-to-john-thune-on-the-iran-letter-seriously/
I wonder if this could be consider traitorous? I can’t imagine any step stronger to embolden the radicals in Iran. Just imagine how these idiots would have acted if the tables were switched. The would, in fact, be calling the other side traitors.
With fools like this in the Congress, America has never been politically weaker than She is today.
Several writers raise the question of whether these Senators have committed a crime by violating the Logan Act, which provides:
“Any citizen of the United States, wherever he may be, who, without authority of the United States, directly or indirectly commences or carries on any correspondence or intercourse with any foreign government or any officer or agent thereof, with intent to influence the measures or conduct of any foreign government or of any officer or agent thereof, in relation to any disputes or controversies with the United States, or to defeat the measures of the United States, shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than three years, or both.
This section shall not abridge the right of a citizen to apply, himself or his agent, to any foreign government or the agents thereof for redress of any injury which he may have sustained from such government or any of its agents or subjects.”
https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/18/953
I was noting that also, BCB, and found this short summary about why the Administration and the Democrats my be holding back from making that accusation directly. What do YOU think? :
http://thedailybanter.com/2015/03/white-house-wont-pursue-gop-senators-iran-letter-logan-act-violation/
Excerpt:
“As Earnest pointed out, the language of the letter is ambiguous enough that a theoretical defense lawyer could argue it is simply a helpful list of (not accurate) facts, and the fact that it’s an open letter would make proving their intent somewhat more difficult. Of course, a theoretical prosecutor could also make the argument that the letter is essentially the Republicans’ way of saying “Nice nuclear deal you got there. Be a shame if anything happened to it.”
It is, at very least, a clear violation of the spirit of the law, and given the precedent being set, I’d be happy to take a chance on such a prosecution.
However, such an uphill fight would not be worth the gamble, politically, and under the current set of facts, the White House is getting the best of both words. Earnest and President Obama are going right up to the line with their criticism of the move, and people like Senate Minority Leader Harry Reid are dancing right on it. The debate helps them more than leaning into the specific accusation ever would.”
Isn’t it past time Dems come together to defend America from internal parasites like wingnuts? One can imagine the cries of treason if Dems had treated dumbass dubya like an ugly,red-headed step child.
It’s just killing them, that black guy
living in the White House.
I thought the same thing re: the Logan Act violation, BCB, but I don’t think Congress violated it. Most people assume that “Without the authority of the United States” is synonymous with “Without the authority of the executive” due to Article 2 clauses. However, there is nothing in the Logan Act that makes this clear. Moreover, the Department of State, when asked about this issue in 1975 said “Nothing in section 953 . . . would appear to restrict members of the Congress from engaging in discussions with foreign officials in pursuance of their legislative duties under the Constitution.” (I’m not getting out my bluebook, but here is a link http://www.lawfareblog.com/2015/03/logan-act/) I think the Logan Act issue is a non-starter from both a legal and political standpoint. Nonetheless, I think it was a damn stupid move by congressional republicans. At least Murkowski kept her good sense.
Why are the Republicans worried that Hillary Clinton will undo any agreement made by Obama?
Rounds and Thune are worthless. Let’s have a townhall meeting. If I sound pissed it’s because I am
Freedom First, John Thune. My arse. That guy and Rounds are gonna have a helluva time wrapping themselves around the flag anymore. They have left that blanket for the crusade trail they now admire. What they do not know is that Iran is now killing ISIS like the professionals they are. Make no mistake, the reason Israel does not screw around in Lebanon any more is because the Iranians trained the locals on how to kick their asses. The best thing for all concerned is peace. Peace brings prosperity and it will bring prosperity to the failed state of Israel as well as to all in the Mid-East. The losers will be the military industrial complex in the United States. bummer.
I think you are confused<Dicta. The Potus negotiates treaties,Congress role is to advise when asked.IT is not their job to undermine legal foreign policy. That is treason, imho. Congress is not negotiating with anyone,they are dictating to the Potus and Iran and threatening the security and stability of these United States of America. That is unconscionable and they brag about it. They must pay a severe price for their actions.
Bill F-if Dems don’t grow a pair and stand up to the wingnut bullies,this undermining of the President will continue for years to come. The time to stop it this shit has passed. The people to do it had better get it done or we are headed for real chaos-brought to you solely by wingnuts R us(eless)
I’m well aware of what Articles 1 and 2 of the constitution state, and the analysis I provided comes from a reasonably seasoned legal scholar. I think, substantively, congressional republicans screwed up. I don’t think there is a viable Logan Act claim and calling it treason is laughable.
Sign the petition. https://petitions.whitehouse.gov/petition/file-charges-against-47-us-senators-violation-logan-act-attempting-undermine-nuclear-agreement/NKQnpJS9
The republican letter is about war, they want a war with Iran and have for sometime. Remember the 2008 presidential campaign and John McCain’s “bomb, bomb Iran”. It seems that McCain picked Cotton to do his dirty work.
I never thought it possible to agree with anything coming out of Iran, but their Foreign Minister is right, this letter has no legal accountability and is pure propaganda designed to undermine the President.
This treaty isn’t even near being finalized so we don’t know its full content, republicans are whining about something that hasn’t happened yet, grandstanding comes to mind.
I voted for President Obama twice because I felt he would do his best to keep us out of a war in middle-east unless it was absolutely necessary, republicans are doing their utmost to spill the blood of young Americans on foreign soil to reward Haliburton.
Treason is just another word for nothing left to lose. Lets face it, this is all about moolah and not Mullahs. Thune and Rounds know who butters their bread and it ain’t the flunkies here in South Dakota, with the exception of Stan. They just showed the world their ass and the world knows clearly that the republican is not fit to negotiate anything regarding peace or anything else for that matter, all is suspect with them. They are full of the war for other people’s kids, certainly not their own, except when you ask them.
What is laughable is making a blow job for a sitting Dem Potus an impeachable offense and completely disregarding war crimes committed by wingnuts.
Bobby Swindle from Louisiana just signed on the traitor line as well. Can we expect our own Daugaard to follow suit? It is, after all, the republican tea party thing. Just a matter of time before Walker, Christie, Perry and whoever else is on the clown car, to throw down.
That’s completely non-responsive and I’m getting shades of the dakotawarcollege’s comments section here now. *claps* I’m making friends everywhere.
http://www.jta.org/2011/06/03/news-opinion/politics/meet-dan-lederman-the-jewish-bail-bondsman-legislator-from-south-dakota
Maybe you could check this out Dicta http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_v._Curtiss-Wright_Export_Corp.
What you are saying is that it is not treason, but can you deny that what Thune and Rounds did was Constitutional? I think not.
How We Know AIPAC Wrote The GOP’s “Treason” Letter To Iran
http://mjrosenberg.net/2015/03/09/how-we-know-aipac-wrote-the-treason-letter-to-iran/
I don’t think it was constitutional, though there is a zero percent chance of a claim against them ever succeeding. I guess that isn’t as sexy as TREASON and KILL THE NON BELIEVERS, but hey, sometimes a dull baritone offsets a shrill cacophony quite nicely.
dicta = pnr.
Another commenter here, or some other spoiled soul?
Very good, that was indeed a landmark case. Now that we have established that what these two jokers did was unconstitutional, what do we do about it? How is it that carrying the Constitution and wrapping yourself around it are okay, but when you completely violate it, you are not called on what you did? Unconstitutional is very sexy and especially sexy when the Iranians knew the US Constitution better that sitting US senators. That is sexy as hell to show what morons the 47 senators are as well as Governor Bobby Swindle of Louisiana. I will suggest this, increase teacher salaries to get the best and the brightest. Then start to educate from the top down on civics along with a strong dose of US Government to show how our nation is supposed to run.
I can’t tell if these borderline fever-dream type rantings and inapposite observations are satire, or if you actually believe that a lack of education is what explains the actions of these senators and not sycophantic kowtowing to the lowest common denominator.
If Thune and Rounds are concerned about nukes in Iran, as they should be, they might want to take a look at the world uranium mining industry and the entire nuclear industry, their own positions on certain nuclear issues and their own campaign donors and supporters.
Rounds’ brother-in-law and sister have been involved in the effort to mine uranium in southwestern South Dakota by a company with a very hidden owernship. This company brags of other mines it owns in unstable countries very close to Iran. There is no guarantee that the uranium mined by this company, even that mined in South Dakota, would not go to further Iranian efforts to construct a nuclear weapon.
A question Thune and Rounds might want to consider is whether mining of uranium in the national interest. There is no guarantee American uranium would not go to uses that would eventually lead to helping Iran or terrorists develop nuclear weapons capabilities.
Certainly Thune and Rounds have opened the door to asking some very important questions of them regarding their positions on the entire nuclear enterprise—from uranium mining to nuclear waste dumps, and how the “peaceful” use of nuclear technology, sold by US companies such as Halliburton and other Republican campaign donors, has been used in the past to further the “breakout” of some countries, including Iran, to nuclear weapons.
Can Rounds and Thune be certain that they have not accepted money from such companies? Are they not then complicit in the Iranian nuclear enterprise? They might want to scour their campaign donor records, and that of their party, and disclose to us how much money these companies may have donated to them.
In that sense, President Obama’s efforts could be seen as attempting to put a halt to the very nuclear programs that Thune’s and Rounds’ contributors were vending to before Obama got sanctions put on Iran. The nuclear industry worldwide is hurting, and limiting the contrifuges and other nuclear technology to Iran will depress the nuclear industry even more. If Rounds, Thune and the other Republicans who take donations from the nuclear industry can scuttle this negotiation, Iran will immediately seek nuclear technology at premium, black market prices, and Thune’s and Rounds’ supporters will enrich themselves beyond belief.
Farfetched? Not really. The worldwide nuclear enterprise is a sketchy industry, far, far worse than Enron ever dreamt of being. You saw their handiwork in how easily they got South Dakota elected official to give up their state sovereignty over uranium regulation. That was, by the way, adided by Rounds’ family.
To Donald’s point:
http://www.argusleader.com/story/news/2015/03/07/ex-federal-scientist-center-uranium-fight/24581135/
Bill, I don’t expect any criminal prosecutions or threats of prosecutions to come out of this. That said, I think most federal prosecutors could make a case to submit to a jury on the Logan issue. Whether a jury would accept a defense lawyer’s ambiguity argument or lack of intent argument is another question. Jurors have a natural tendency to believe law enforcement and prosecutors and a tendency to doubt whatever defense lawyers argue.
As for either the White House or Democrats making the accusation, it appears they don’t need to. Political analysts and writer are handling that.
Dicta, as my comment to Bill explains, whether there was a violation of the act seems to be a factual question that would be answered by 12 jurors, rather than the court. I agree that the statute is a bit ambiguous and that the letter itself is a bit ambiguous. Some of the signers of the letter, however, are making public statements that could arguably make their intent much less ambiguous.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2015/03/09/tom-cotton-iran_n_6831328.html
Plus, the Curtis-Wright case Jerry cited seems to support a Logan prosecution if anyone really wanted to go there.
I’ve read the law blog post Dicta shares. I’m inclined to agree with the analysis there and in Dicta’s comment. Vladeck at Law Fare Blog notes that the number of people convicted of violating the Logan Act is zero; the last Logan Act indictment was in 1803. The law may have lapsed for lack of use (see desuetude).
Furthermore, what? I can’t write a letter to François Hollande or Vladimir Putin and urge changes in their economic or human rights policies? Um, First Amendment, anyone?
I also agree with Fleming’s source on the nature of the letter. As an “open letter,” the Senators’ communiqué seems all the more protected by the First Amendment. Senators are free to publish opinion columns on world affairs.
We probably won’t be able to make a legal case. We’ll have to settle for making a jerk case: Rounds and Thune are being jerks by trying to undercut U.S. diplomacy.
Rounds and Thune may also be encouraging Armageddon. Check out what instigator Cotton thinks we should do instead of diplomacy:
In my opinion, the negotiations were a grievous mistake from the beginning, and they quickly became a sham; now they’re a farce,” Cotton told a group of reporters on the sidelines of the Foreign Policy Initiative’s (FPI) annual forum.
Bomb bomb bomb, bomb bomb Iran….
Absolutely amazing that no matter what a wingnut does,it is never considered criminal.
http://www.theatlantic.com/international/archive/2015/03/tom-cotton-may-just-have-undermined-his-own-cause/387382/?utm_source=SFTwitter
Thune and Rounds owe their souls to AIPAC and the defense lobby: why anyone is surprised by their treachery remains a mystery.
Good article Larry. Being hoist on one’s own petard seems to be a time honored GOP congressional sport.
There are many good comments here. For me the trail to follow is The Money. War is an almost incomprehensibly massive cash cow for Darth Cheney and the Haliburton types. Remember the Evil One’s (Darth C’s) ambitious goal of perpetual war?
I don’t know of anything more evil than working to create and maintain endless deaths of thousands and destruction on a region wide scale. It’s inhuman. Truly.
I am sadly but thoroughly convinced that those desiring their eternal war are absolutely psychopathic. And they are controlling this nation. Canada, here I come.
What Cotton and the rest of the subversives fail to realize with their war talk, is how Israel would fly to Iran to deliver these munitions he callously speaks of. Cotton and the rest of the ignorant do not fully realize where Iran actually is and how to get there. Whose sky do you have to fly to make the trip? The other key thing is American interests and in particular, American troops and how they will be protected. How many Navy personnel is the Cotton Club willing to sacrifice for his blood letting? What about the rest of the branches that are already on station in the area Qatar, Kuwait the Emirates?
Iran has a respected military combination of air land and water forces. They know how to do small unit tactics that is disruptive in a hostile land. The question to the Cotton Club and to its members like Thune and Rounds should be how is the US military going to put boots on the ground in Iran? How are they even going to get there? Will they endorse the Charge of the Light Brigade? When will they initiate the draft for their madness? Who will underwrite the charge card? I thought we were concerned about the debt?
Check this out to see where the world’s best wrestlers come from, the real ones http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_World_and_Olympic_Champions_in_Greco-Roman_wrestling
Iran is not Sadam’s Iraq and we will not be greeted with flowers. We will not pay for the war with their oil. This is like Iraq in so many ways, the ways of defeat at great expense to blood and treasure. President Obama is making great strides to keep us safe and to keep the world safe, maybe we should let the adults keep this ship on course.
Keeping in mind all the well articulated comments here and on social media, I am convinced that republicans don’t want any treaty or agreement with Iran on nuclear capabilities.
Regardless of what President Obama and the Secretary State come with in terms of a treaty republican war mongers will reject it even if does in fact protect their own best interests.
Dang, did Deb just hit the nail on the head? A deal with Iran forestalls war. Iran is the next best likely candidate for an expensive war that the American people would support (threatening Israel, jerking our chain since 1979—let’s get those SOBs!). The last thing a military-industrial complex subsisting on perpetual war wants is peace with a non-nuclear Iran.
Jerry said, “How many Navy personnel is the Cotton Club willing to sacrifice for his blood letting? What about the rest of the branches that are already on station in the area Qatar, Kuwait the Emirates?”
I think Jerry’s concerns are irrelevant to the psychopaths in charge of the Republican party. Simply irrelevant.
Senator Thune explains his vote on PBS Newshour tonight:
http://www.pbs.org/newshour/bb/senators-go-around-president-iran/
Senator Thune accuses the Vice President of hypocrisy and contends that Congress, as a coequal branch of government, especially in regard to treaties, should have a coequal voice in the process.
Funny: I thought the advice and consent of ratification happened after the treaty was finalized by the Executive Branch and the foreign power.
Cotton Club—let that name stick!
This doesn’t surprise me. What more can we expect from any of our politicians?
Cory, that was the way it worked, until a black Democrat became president.
Cotton is a condescending, egotistical twerp, and our two stellar senators just signed his letter. What does that make them? Worthless!!
Dick Cheney is in President Obama’s defense on this Iran matter. His words throw water on the Cotton Club to make them shrink. http://www.c-span.org/video/standalone/?844-1/irancontra-minority-report&popoutPlayer
Thune should call his leader and speak to him on this as it makes him look like the ass he is now.
Rounds is a freshman so he gets a point for being ignorant. Thune though, and the rest of the leadership of the Senate got rolled by a freshman. The Lee Harvey Oswald look alike conned them into thinking they are relevant in this peace process. What a bunch of clucks.
They simply cannot govern. The republican is a dwarf in government with the only thing they are being capable of, is muddying the water.
I wonder who stands to gain by all of this? http://www.lmlcsteam.com/?utm_source=TheHill&utm_medium=BANNER&utm_content=LCS&utm_campaign=MST%20LCS%20US
Steve King from Iowa gets the Logan Act and how it works to try to screw over Democrats. http://thehill.com/homenews/news/12355-house-republican-wants-to-restrict-pelosis-travel
Oh, Jerry—that 2007 article seems significant, at least in terms of the responses Republicans may choose. However, I don’t think it negates the legal arguments to which Dicta alerted us.
And check out Pelosi’s spokesperson’s response to King’s Logan attack in 2007:
Anyone care to distinguish Pelosi’s travel to Syria under Bush and the Cotton Club’s open letter to Iran under Obama?
Keep in mind that Pelosi was acting as a courier between Israel and Syria. If you will note, Syria and Israel share a border and have a working relationship. You will also note that ISIS does not make any efforts whatsoever to attack Israel. So the efforts of Pelosi were probably green lighted by the president of the United States in coordination with Israel as that can be the only reason for the high level courier transfer. As far as I can see, nothing more was done regarding this as it was basically between King and Pelosi and could have been a ploy. Pelosi did not stain the Constitution with the courier transfer as it was between two governments Israel and Syria.
I do not argue Dicta in the regards of treason. I think the traitor part is accurate though and has been since President Obama was elected. The republican has done all that it can to undermine the country. One only needs to look back recently with a foreign leader addressing the congress to sell a faulty bill of goods to prop up a failed economy by trying to drag us down with him. A junkie will do the same thing to get their fix. The republican embraced this and then added this nugget of a letter from a freshman Senator no less. What Dicta agrees with and what I agree with is the Cotton Club defiled the Constitution of which we all live under. The unconstitutional act the Cotton Club let to their brethren hardliners in Iran was very clear.
ditca-i voted for weiland-no regrets. u are a fool to admit here voting for rounds and thune. why bother coming over here?
o-love it!!
oh, 1. 1968-republican candidate nixon torpedoed democratic president johnson during the vietnam war in the paris peace talks. no logan act prosecution.
2. 1980-republican candidate reagan/bush torpedoed democratic president carter during iran “october surprise [treason]” hostage negotiations. no logan act prosecution.
3. 2015-racist republican boehner torpedoes democratic president obama in iran nuke negotiations inviting netenyahu to congress. no logan act prosecution.
4. yesterday-sd republicans thune & rounds torpedo democratic president obama’s iran nuke negotiations. no leadership statement on the “Allen 57” racism. no logan act prosecution.
5. repubicans vote 55+ times to take health care away from 15 million. republican SCOTUS succeeds in taking away health care from 48,000 south dakotans, killing 30-90 anually.
seems like republicans cheat, waste time and democrats let ‘um, then spend all their time fixing the damage.
dicta means squat
remember EB5!!
sorry-trickey dick burgled democrats in 68 at watergate, he screwed the peace talks in 1973.
http://www.foreignpolicyjournal.com/2010/01/27/rogue-state-israeli-violations-of-u-n-security-council-resolutions/view-all/
Iraq violated 14 UN resolutions before we just absolutely had to invade to teach then respect for that august body. Look how many resolutions Israel has ignored and why haven’t we just had to absolutely invade Israel to teach them respect for that august body?
evil axis. squirrel. evil axis. squirrel. thune, rounds, get back here!
republicans: AR-15, AMERICA’S FAVORITE RIFLE IS AN ASSAULT RIFLE!!
republican “TRAITORS” mcconnell, paul, cruz, cotton, thune, rounds. nydn 3.10.15
“reckless, misguided stunt”, id., the hill, 3.11.2015
Hey, Leslie, come on. We don’t use language like “Why bother coming over here?” to drive away folks who voted for the other side. Keep that up, and we will sound like the DWC comment section, as Dicta here properly accuses us. The last thing I want is a comment section where the only people I hear are a handful of Dems who agree with me on everything. If our mission is to make sure people don’t vote for Rounds and Thune again, we need to invite those who do vote for Rounds and Thune to come converse with us. I need your help to make that happen.
perhaps we all can discuss this issue. your job is to keep ’em, my job is to call ’em out for the damage their party does, intentionally, day in and day out. i am quite sure it would be a popular thread with a dozen republicans i can think of, that will no doubt pile on. i do appreciate your suggestion, but as pointed out above when republicans can only make nice from scorching earth when they tactically want something, rather than practicing any art of compromise, it does democrats no good to extend a hand. there have to be consequences for severe behavior.
sen. corker(R): “the letter to iran [was]…due to passion from a threatened veto [no. 3] on ‘common sense legislation’….”
pres. obama: “KXL…250, maybe 300 jobs….”
national infrastructure for the masses, or a KOCH gift and to hell with the future of a healthy enviro ment, thune, rounds?
It does no good to tell sincere commenters like Dicta to hit the bricks. Dicta expressed anger at Rounds and admitted voting for him, acknowledging responsibility for Rounds’s bad choice. We can focus our criticism on Rounds and invite folks of good conscience like Dicta to come with us. We have to extend a hand, because a minority party isn’t going to beat the majority party without help. When an issue like this can get traction with Rounds voters, we need to maximize that traction with good arguments, not ad hominem and exclusion.
I sure like when people tell me “what republicans are like,” as if we are some sort of monolithic entity where nobody ever disagrees. I mean, it’s not like I expressed disagreement with my party in this very comments section, Leslie. Good thing you are here to be logical for me, since my reptile brain has so obviously shut down and I constantly sing Rounds’ praises.
The irony in all this, Leslie, is that you would shout down moderates in the same manner the ultra-conservative tend to do without taking the time to actually listen to what someone with a different opinion has to say. And you are so dedicated to your world view that even when they agree with you on a topic, you can’t help but fire shots at them because you feel justified in doing so.
I’ll say the same thing to you I say to the social conservatives in my own party: it must be really nice to have a monopoly on morality.
All Republicans are entitled earth haters happy to poop upstream of those who can’t afford legal counsel. Thune, Rounds and Noem are clearly evidence of that.
“All republicans.” Awesome. I think I’m done with this site. Enjoy your echo chamber.
Anonymi could be anyone from anywhere acting as concern trolls for any whim. No doubt where the door will hit Dickta on the way out.
The GOP began hating the Earth in 1991 after the Berlin Wall fell and before Israel became a bigger pariah state than Iran. Thune and Rounds stepped into this Cotton mess because they were told to.
righto on exclusion-bad, i meant to say “foolish,” but dicta-don’t just say you are sorry, bring another republican that’ll vote democratic and introduce us!
corey-dicta knows “dicta” does mean squat. no personal fowl, except for his “fever dream rantings”
rounds’ “stupid, stupid grandstanding”? try his delayed, pre-election nah-na-na to EB5 questioners and RCJ’s uncovered “misstatements” (soft enough, cory?) in your own state.
what would thune and rounds have to do to lose your vote, put our navy in the black sea at risk from the republicans’ favorite home-wrecker, “vlad (‘i call him vlad’) putin??” laughable? speaking of stupid, stupid grandstanding!
until republicans of good conscience dicta, can stop blaming a “shout down-so dedicated to an own world-view”, recognize that GOP governance is ever only “my way or the highway,” and get over calling us laughable-a phrase well used by that side, then you may learn, learn why the logan act may be important here; there is no changing a pattern of behavior evidenced above since 1969, 1973, 1980, 2001’s cheney energy secret task force (meeting 10x between jan. and may), 1.10.2009 (GOP Obstruction Dinner), and now by both Boehner and the Senate (R) 47, as spun and spoken for by McConnell this morning.
cliches about morality are trite, but you put rounds in office for 6 years unless he is indicted for EB5 failure of oversight or worse.
we need to take the republic out of republicans and return the nation and state to a democracy.
Dicta, I’ve seen several blog administrators try with varying levels of sucess to moderate the quality of dialogue on their pages. I’ve also taken a brief stab it myself, and so, appreciate the difficulty of the task. I don’t blame you for being frustrated, but I will say that if you withdraw from the conversation, The quality of the dialogue here will suffer. Many times I’ve waded into the DWC shit-storm to make a point, and fully expected to be pummeled for making the effort. Like you, I don’t like being stereotyped, and recognize the shallowness in those who feel they have to put everything in a box of their own making in order to justify their seemingly superior position. It seems to be part of the nature of these blogs, and there’s probably not much that can be done about it. That said, its not those comments, but rather those more thoughtful and well considered that make these blogs the little treasures that they are by giving us access to ideas we might not find anywhere else, and a taste of genuine human personalities from around our region willing to share themselves with others and work things through, even when it means having to wade through a garbage dump sometimes. For those reasons, I hope you take a break, reassess, and come back to share when you have something you want to say and wish to be read and considered by reasonable people. I assure you we are here, and waiting precisely for the type of dialogue you also obviously crave.
and use your real name.
Thune, Rounds and the Cotton Club, threw feces against the wall to see if it would stick. It failed miserably and now they have to answer as to why they did the unthinkable, violate the Constitution they swore to defend and protect. The money men wanted them to do what they have been paid to do, stand and deliver for them. We are now seeing that these same money men want to export the drones to these unstable countries so they can unleash the dogs of war on whomever. Our own soon to be local personnel, are suffering the same fate as our soldiers and veterans that were and are on the ground in these meat grinders. The rates of PTSD among those who have only seen a battleground from a base thousands of miles from the target, is tremendous. No more War! No more violations of our Constitution.
Personally, I don’t care about real names. Mark Twain didn’t use his.
If you can write like Mark Twain, or even 1/10th as well, I want to read you, whatever you choose to call yourself. :-)
thus spake grudznick.
You are correct Bill Fleming. Mark Twain is much easier to write than his real name. That is why I choose the name jerry rather than my real name of Schanxenfureed Baualexstad. I do hope that all will understand.
oh, jerry. fleming is like a mouse with a moth: he likes to play with his food before he eats it.
freudian post: should have been like a cat with a mouse or a moth. i’m psychotic.
Glad to see the Outrage Brigade in full bloom over treasonous acts. While the Administration has it panties twisted into a thong over this open letter, they seem to be oblivious along with the obsequious press of Senator Ted Kennedy’s secret invitation to Soviet leader Yuri Andropov in 1984. Soviet documents discovered in 1991reveal Kennedy asking the Soviets to intervene in the 1984 elections on the Democrats behalf.
From Forbes magazine:
“Kennedy’s message was simple. He proposed an unabashed quid pro quo. Kennedy would lend Andropov a hand in dealing with President Reagan. In return, the Soviet leader would lend the Democratic Party a hand in challenging Reagan in the 1984 presidential election. “The only real potential threats to Reagan are problems of war and peace and Soviet-American relations,” the memorandum stated. “These issues, according to the senator, will without a doubt become the most important of the election campaign.”
Read it all here:
http://www.forbes.com/2009/08/27/ted-kennedy-soviet-union-ronald-reagan-opinions-columnists-peter-robinson.html
Also the Lawfare blog linked by Dicta makes the following observation. Note Senator Biden’s reference to “Senate prerogative regarding international arms control agreements”, the point Thune was making on NPR.
“That argument, in a nutshell, is that the President lacks the authority under the U.S. Constitution to negotiate a pure Executive agreement in this context. Almost all major arms control agreements have been made as treaties that needed Senate consent, and the one major exception, the Salt I treaty, was a congressional-executive agreement. Past presidents surely must have made minor arms control agreements pursuant to Executive agreement at some point (I have not researched the point), but at a minimum the scope of the President’s domestic constitutional authority to make a binding executive agreement with Iran on control of its nuclear weapons is an open question. It is also true that the Senate has long taken the view that at least major arms control treaties must pass through the Senate for its consent. A good statement of this view can be seen in a letter, co-written in 2002 by Senator Biden to Secretary of State Powell, outlining “Senate prerogative regarding international arms control agreements” in a context similar (though not identical) to the current one. (The context was President Bush’s nuclear arms reduction agreement with Russia, which Biden, a lion of Senate prerogatives, insisted be approved via the treaty process.”
Here: http://www.lawfareblog.com/2015/03/more-on-the-senates-role-in-the-impending-iran-deal/
LOL. Yes, I’m like a mouse to a flame. Hilarious.
http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2015/03/10/republicans-admit-that-iran-letter-was-a-dumb-idea.html
Hey, “Don”, tell us what’s so objectionable about being outraged by outrageous acts. Or is your standard simply that we aren’t allowed to be outraged at the people who vote your way?
Cory said: “We have to extend a hand, because a minority party isn’t going to beat the majority party without help.”
But isn’t that really the crux of this issue? Voters vote for party – not candidates and issues. Candidates work for the party – not consistant individual ideals. I don’t want to put words in Dika’s mouth, but I know plenty of SD voters that voted for Rounds because he was the Republican – end of story (and yes, plenty of Democrats did the same mindless party-voting for their candidates). Once in DC, and the National GOP machine gets more direct influence these elected officials, do any of us believe that all those GOP leaders have a real issue with the premise of presidents negotiating treaties with foreign governments? Or is this purely political – a GOP stab at the sitting Democratic leader? Would those GOP signatories be happier of no president EVER negotiated a treaty again?
Partisan, competitive politics is destroying this nation.
Someone remind me why we’re beating up Dicta. He provides good reading that gives good reasons for us not to waste our time on trying to convict Rounds and Thune of a Logan Act violation.
And since I’m feeling Dicta’s pain, I’ll note that Larry’s generalization is proven wrong by the fact that not all Republicans signed the letter. Republican Senator Jeff Flake from Arizona was on NPR yesterday saying such intrusions on negotiations aren’t productive.
Focus your fire, people. Thune and Rounds are acting unwisely. Get as many people as possible, including Thune and Rounds voters, to listen to that fact, and don’t be drawn into the distractions that “Don Coyote” and others need to marginalize our proper and patriotic outrage.
O duly reminds me that the ultimate goal is not just for Dems to win. It’s for truth, justice, and, in this case, proper separation of powers and a united front against our foreign enemies to win. We should focus on showing people that partisan politics is driving Thune, Rounds, and other Republicans to commit unwise acts against America’s best interest. We could make America better by replacing Thune and Rounds with conscientious Democrats or Independents or just by getting the Republican leadership to recognize the error of their ways and rein in such excesses.
Jon Stewart makes the same point that DC makes. Democrats behaved in a similar manner in the past, and the talking heads from the right called it a terrible unpatriotic thing when Democrats did it but now defend the Republicans, while there were Democrats that defended the conduct of Democrats back then, but now condemn the Republicans.
http://www.salon.com/2015/03/11/were_fking_cuckoo_cuckoo_bananas_jon_stewart_on_the_gop_senators_letter_to_iran/?source=newsletter
Stewart makes another point that I missed at first. On the surface it appears Thune and Rounds are saying Iran cannot trust our current President. But they also point out that President O’Bama will be out of office in 2017, and reminds Iran that Senators have 6 year terms and will be around long after O’Bama is gone, perhaps even for decades.
So the Senators are not saying that Iran cannot trust O’Bama, rather, the Senators are saying that Iran cannot trust the Senate signers of the letter to abide by any negotiated agreements!
Dickta had a good argument and stated it. I agree with it. We also agree that what the Cotton Club did was against the Constitution, as it is clear. The 2007 matter with Pelosi was different in tone because it involved a humanitarian effort sought by Israel for her missing in action IDF and she also delivered government to government private papers. Those two governments were Israel and Syria, not the United States. Of that we are clear. Dickta has every right to provide voice, more so perhaps, because he has acknowledged the trust of his vote to a man that is not serving his office correctly.
Here is what the Cotton Club fears the most. Iranian forces have been shelling Tikrit for days now and pulverizing the place where ISIS is holed up. http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/03/11/us-mideast-crisis-iraq-tirkit-idUSKBN0M713X20150311
Now they will mop it up and continue towards Mosul to gain control over lands that ISIS took from the American trained Iraqi forces. The Iranian military in coordination with the Shia militias are doing this on their own. American lives are not being tossed into this chaos and the Cotton Club is not making any money for their benefactors, the military industrial complex. Why in the world would we want to be involved with this other than money? The Cotton Club knows this and so do any other new signers to the letter. It is all about the money, blood money.
Denise Ross just reminded listeners of Bill Janklow’s idea of public radio that Thune called out Daschle for similar actions in the past.
http://www.politico.com/story/2014/06/john-thune-mitch-mcconnell-tom-daschle-108366.html
Wingnuts(traitors) made it clear when Obama was legally elected they would do everything in their power to discredit him and his administration,they were willing to allow America to default on it’s constitutional obligations to pay her debts if they could get the public to believe Obama was the cause. They said their goal was to make Obama a one term Potus. All treasonable actions since wingnuts believed lying about sex was an impeachable offense.
It is the purview of the executive branch(i.e. the Potus) to negotiate treaties and conduct foreign policy. Any attempts to undermine the Potus and the nation is despicably rethuglican and treasonous!! I could care what the so called experts claim.
As an aside,Iran wouldn’t be a problem had neo-cons not screwed up the balance of power in the Middle East by removing the glue that held Iraq together and stable. More crimes for which wingnuts should pay a heavy price.
Dicta is correct in thinking that introducing the Logan Act in court is a far stretch at best. However, the GOP is losing in the court of public opinion. Like foreign policy experts, newspapers around the country and even in the reddest of states have lambasted the Republican letter signers like Thune and Rounds.
Megan Kelly over at Fox News even blasted letter writer Senator Cotton and asked him “What’s the point of writing Iranian Mullahs?” Senator Corker goes on the record as saying that the Iranian nuclear threat was “too important to divide us among partisan lines.”
GOP aides have tried to deflect the letter fallout that it was just a ‘cheeky’ gesture and that the President has no sense of humor around the nuclear negotiations.
John McCain, the war hawk, even admitted that it probably wasn’t the best thing to do and observed that the letter might not have been the best way to express frustration that President Obama isn’t working with Congress on nuclear negotiations with Tehran.
Of course he then let’s out a little dog whistle to the conservative right and says that “they can call it a banana, but it’s a treaty.” Really John, a banana…still have some of those racist cartoons about the President of These United States hanging on your wall?
Meanwhile in other news, Conservative thought leader Bill Kristol blamed the racist chants sung by white fraternity boys in Oklahoma on black rap music.
Isn’t this all one big distraction? The question is not so much what “is” the GOP doing, but what it is NOT.
Republicans control both chambers of the federal legislature, and this is what comes of that majority. Where is the GOP GOVERNANCE? Where is the jobs bill? Where is the legislation for the middle class (from last week’s news cycle for the GOP)? When will the GOP act like the governing majority and not the fringe party trying to undermine their Democratic rivals?
The list of legislative non-starts and internal blow ups ranging from abortion prohibitions to tax reform SHOULD be what is headline news. Where is that promised “better than the ACA” health care?
It is rather difficult these days to find a republican that can walk and chew gum at the same time, Dicta is a rarity in the republican party.
I rarely agree with Dicta, but he does provide well articulated comments above the usual tea party bumper sticker slogans of the tea party.
I’ve always enjoyed enlightening conversations with republicans that have a capability to discuss and not rant. Hell, I’ve had some good and often heated discussions with Troy Jones from the Dump Site and they were never reduced to name shouting matches or name calling.
It is my hope that Dicta reconsiders and continues to comment.
@6:51 sen. corker may have meant the upcoming veto of proposed iranian sanctions which will be a blow to netanyahu’s pep rally here w/ the american israeli committee of big money last week.
many see this as racism; usatoday, nyt. more later
You are correct Jana, who knew that Thune and Rounds were such frat boys in the Cotton Club. Just humor in the shower room together snapping one another’s behinds with towels. Of course, this is Obama’s fault for not having a referee in that shower room to prevent their antics. What a bunch of giddy traitors led by a freshman no less. The republican is leaderless and a failure at governing completely and absolutely. They are good at bumper stickers though, “Freedom First, John Thune” no wonder dogs hike their leg on those bumpers.
In related news, it appears that Netanyahu is in serious trouble back home. With only six days to the election of Israel prime minister, Bibi is behind in the polls according to CNN.
It is quite likely that the Boehner invite to the prime minister has backfired. If Netanyahu prevails in the election, the victory margin will be slim and may well cause further unrest in the Middle-East.
Et tu Fox? They reluctantly mention the Iranians as mentors but as noted, no American involvement. Good news for American families, you loved ones are not getting maimed or killed. http://www.foxnews.com/world/2015/03/11/iraqi-forces-enter-isis-held-city-tikrit-officials-and-witnesses-say/
Some are calling the signers traitors, though Wapo’s Dana Milbank doesn’t go that far.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/republicans-set-up-their-own-breakaway-nation/2015/03/10/1618f6d4-c749-11e4-b2a1-bed1aaea2816_story.html?wpisrc=nl_pdmost&wpmm=1
We have this, from Milbank’s column:
“On Tuesday, the day after his letter to Hezbollah’s masters became public, Cotton provided a clue about his motives: He’d had a breakfast date with the National Defense Industrial Association — a trade group for Lockheed Martin, Northrop Grumman, Boeing and the like.”
Nothing like Republican Greed to leave a wide and deep trail of dead American youth in its wake.
Good article,Deb. If it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck and makes green messes on sidewalks itsa treason.
More news from Iraq without American lives in jeopardy there. We do not need boots on the ground there, never did and hopefully, never will again. Iraq and the Mideast sand is quick to devour you. http://www.rferl.org/content/islamic-state-iraq-anbar-retreat/26894544.html Now ISIS seeks a solution in its retreat. The Cotton Club cannot stand this as blood money is getting away from his benefactors. Thune and Rounds also smell the greenbacks to sell American blood for. Follow the money and it turns up at their doorstep one way or another.
Just keep quiet about Obamacare as well says one of the Cotton Club. http://thehill.com/policy/healthcare/235347-top-gop-senator-tells-white-house-to-stop-celebrating-on-obamacare-figures
The republican just wants you to go fight and die for them, they do not want to care for veterans nor do they want to see the wee little people get life saving insurance. Ask Daugaard, he will tell you the same as what Thune and Rounds and whats her name say.
I will add my vote to the Yes column for Dicta and a variety of other reasonable political positions here. I draw the line at extremist ranters who contribute nothing of value. I have no problem with pseudonyms either. Many people have good reasons to protect their identity. I used a pseudonym in the past.
Jerry, here’s what the Republicans and devoted Obama haters don’t want you to see, if Obamacare is killed it will cost many millions and endanger their health.
It will be like a $147,000,000 dogma tax on South Dakotans.
http://www.commonwealthfund.org/interactives-and-data/maps-and-data/state-exchange-map
I think Dicta is ok as well. We might disagree but as long as it doesn’t get into a name calling event I’m find with it. I agree with Cory. We can’t turn this into the DWC
in case you guys missed it, after huffing out of here ‘dicta’ went over to SDWC and tried to pick a fight with Pat and his multiple personalities.
What’s next from our moral midgets; will Thune and Rounds be pen pals with Putin? Castro? Kim Jung-un? They made ol’ Jane Fonda look very, very good in contrast.
Jerry, the big pile of GOP just gets sloppier:
http://www.politico.com/story/2015/03/republicans-surprised-by-iran-letter-blowback-116003.html
Last I checked,182000 signed the petition against wingnuts.
This is a visual explanation of what went on with the traitors.
http://assets.amuniversal.com/a992c2f0a7e10132cd28005056a9545d
All you need know about the republican and their complete lack of responsibility towards this country in one quote. From the head war monger himself no less. John McCain: “It was kind of a very rapid process. Everybody was looking forward to getting out of town because of the snowstorm.” They care more about getting home to their families than putting the families of service men and women in the correct context. Maybe the peanuts on the flight was what they were all giddy about.
Think of the jeopardy the freshman nincompoop put America in. We are talking war here, very clearly. We are speaking of our military put in harms way. We lost 11 in Florida while training, so the job they do is dangerous in itself without bullets flying. But what this bunch of traitors did was inexcusable given the situation and who they sent the letter to.
“Generally good” is so true Deb
Larry, why do you keep reading the DWC comment section?
I’m buying the military-industrial argument. Thune and Rounds are willing to back a guy who would help Israel start a war with Iran. Thune and Rounds are essentially saying we’d rather march more South Dakota sons and daughters off to the Middle East to die for oil than work toward a peaceable solution. Remember that, South Dakota.
cotton, youngest in congress, is harvard law, combat vet iraq&afghanistan, clerked for fed appeals judge, practiced labor law for a year or two, returned home to raise cows, and wrote an op ed that nyt pulitzer prize winners should be charged w/ espionage from the front lines for exposing iraqi financial sanctions. angry young man perhaps ptsd. mcconnell used him? they are pissed obama is threatening a 4th veto over increase iran sanctions. cotton could turn into a heavyweight.
repubs other young star, besides noem, is arron schock, who is cratering for bad judgment since his selfie w/our kristi (who is pissed at obama for keystone veto, supports netanyahu speech and is chasing the IRS down), and before. republicans are after the youth vote
larry-liked your post about sdwc above and also the buffalo commons blog on todays dry lands in the center of the nation
maine’s other senator king puts this in perspective on maddow tonight- it is as if republicans had inserted themselves between “jfk and khrushchev during the cuban missile crisis.” how about that in a cartoon, deb?
Cory, you ask Larry why he reads the comments over at SDWC. Could be that it doesn’t take long as there are only 44 comments on the entire front page! 10 posts and only 44 comments, ouch!
it’s important to know the enemy to flank his position.
Larry, we can write those comments in our sleep. But hey, knock yourself out.
Wingnuts are claiming,not that they have a right to negotiate treaties,but that they want to be included in negotiating. Bunch of liars-all. Every time Obama extends an olive branch to these cretins they send back a handful of bloody corks with racially tinged slurs printed with Obama’s blood.
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2015/03/12/1370336/-Lt-Col-Joni-Ernst-should-be-court-martialed-for-signing-the-seditious-letter-to-Iran#
Iowans thought they were getting the whole hog, but all they go was the oink. One republican, that was not afraid of the snow and respected his uniform, was Senator Lindsey Graham. Apparently, even war hawks understand the significance of what this traitorous letter contained.
Looks like Jewish writers actually wrote the letter the Cotton Club submitted. http://mjrosenberg.net/2015/03/09/how-we-know-aipac-wrote-the-treason-letter-to-iran/
jerry, see my link to rosenberg above. it’s important to use ‘Israeli’ rather than ‘Jewish’ lest you get a visit from the JDL, IDF or Mossad.
Cotton got a cool million bucks for this letter. Not bad pay for sticking the shiv in the back of your country, beats the hell out of a couple of pieces of silver. It is all about the money. Our two senators got paid handsomely for their little ink spots as well, you can count on it. http://rightweb.irc-online.org/profile/emergency_committee_for_israel
Larry Kurtz offers good advice on avoiding unnecessarily inflammatory and distracting language. #irony.
Other than the language choice, good links, Jerry! Here’s another:
http://mondoweiss.net/2015/03/israel-fingerprints-republican
Key text:
Whoever is writing Cotton’s letters, let’s remember the big takeaway for South Dakota voters in 2016: D.C. leadership is making John Thune forget South Dakota values. He’s participating in an effort to undermine American diplomacy and provoke war. His support for the Cotton letter is a step toward again sending South Dakota sons and daughters to die in the desert sands of the Middle East.
You are correct Larry, duly noted on the Israeli contribution, yikes. It looks like Cotton wants to be the leader of the free world, can you just imagine the fun we will have in Oceania? More war and more pieces of silver for the Cotton Club. Thune and Rounds will just buy the state, but who gets what? Does the Murdo boy even want the sagebrush? Here is their new leaders rise to the top of the clown car, look out Rand, beware Cruz, forgetaboutit Tubby from Jersey, Walker was so yesterday. http://www.nytimes.com/2015/03/12/us/politics/senator-behind-iran-letter-is-latest-freshman-republican-to-stir-things-up.html?ref=politics&_r=0
Cotton will now be in the money circuit, books to follow.
Sorry for my to broad of a paintbrush. Your link to Bloody Bill is the fire to the smoke. It was a twitter joke, more or less, that the letter was such a bad one that the only author could have been Bill Kristol. Now the money that poured into Arkansas means only one thing, we had better prepare ourselves for the inevitable wars that will follow. When does the draft begin, that will be the tell, because we simply do not have the manpower to put boots on the ground in Syria, Iraq, Iran, not to mention Africa. Even then, it may be to late. Rome had the same issue as have all empires and could not count on allies, even when paid large sums.
Foreign press is on top of things because we seem to be lacking here. http://america.aljazeera.com/blogs/scrutineer/2015/3/9/what-46-republican-senators-may-not-understand-about-iran.html
The arrogance of the Cotton Club to think that we are all important in the big scheme of this speaks for itself.
Lindsey Graham from South Carolina, a beacon of racial understanding, is a member of the Cotton Club. I missed his name.
bcb:
Just to note…. I’m pretty sure he isn’t Irish.
He actually does have Irish heritage. http://www.origins.net/help/resarticle-obama.aspx
Yes, he is Irish.
He’s also related to Wild Bill Hickock. :-) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ann_Dunham
(p.s. I myself am Irish, and if I say he’s Irish, he’s Irish. That’s me storie an’ I’m stickin’ to it.)
This is a beautiful thing. Peres just endorsed Herzog. Nutanyahoo down 5 seats for sure maybe 7.http://www.jpost.com/Israel-Elections/Peres-endorses-Herzog-for-prime-minister-393689
jerry-the list that came out only had 40 names,not 47. I counted because I couldn’t account for Carpetbagger Barbie Dan Sullivan-frosh sinator of Alaska. He was not on the list of those who signed and the seven who did not sign.
As I stated before,Israel is driving US foreign policy in regards to the M.E. and they want all their enemies killed by and paid for by Americans. Hillary plays right into that.
Jerry brings up a whole new wrinkle that may get uncomfortable for the Cotton Club, John Thune and Mike Rounds.
Think of the consequences if Bibi loses. The Senate will have alienated the new controlling party of Israel, strengthened Obama’s status with Israel and branded themselves as inconsequential in global politics.
The GOP and hardline Republicans will have given proof positive that they are nothing other than a “Blusterf**k” when it comes to governing. All bluster for the opportunistic political moment without one consideration for what the consequences might be outside of lining their own pockets.
What was missed is that it is not so much of a US and Iranian thing as a Iranian and the rest of the security council. That council holds the keys to the sanctions and if China and Russia sense that this could go astray, you can bet they will be supplying the Iranians with a lot more sophisticated ground to ground and ground to air armaments. The republican got what they wanted in how to fund raise and the money boys at the military industrial complex got their golden boy. Reasonably cheap as well, what is a million bucks of taxpayer money in an already bloated defense system. The name should be changed though, to the Department of Offense, as it is becoming offensive with the waste.
Bill Fleming, could I trademark “Blusterf**k?”
Apologies to Cory in advance if the asterisks aren’t enough to fit the etiquette of site. If it’s over the top, feel free to take it down with no hard feelings.
The term just seems to fit the current day GOP…even our good old boys in Pierre.
Me, inflammatory and distracting? Cory, you cut me to the quick.
It’s time to move Israel to Utah, people.
Jana. You already have the copyright, by virtue of having written it, the only caveat being whether or not Cory claims copyright for everything we write here, which I assume is contestable… we’d have to ask Mr. Duffy. ;-) As for Trademark, you can apply for one, but I think you only really get one (Federal) if you sell something with that name on it across state lines. (Maybe have somebody who reads here but lives in a different state send you a dollar for the privilege of having read your mark, and tell them also to send Cory a tip just because he deserves one.) Then download your paperwork from the US Trademark and Patent office, fill it out, send it in, and you should be good to go. (I think it costs about $200 bucks. Haven’t done one in a while. :-)
Thanks Bill.
I think instead, everyone should send Cory the $200 and use the term “Blusterf**k” whenever it fits!
An eager reader shares this newly discovered original draft of the Cotton Club letter to Iran (wink): https://twitter.com/KumarsSalehi/status/575864080457592832
So, does that mean we can’t say or write “blusterf##k?” Jana, I can understand you wanting to have the term for t-shirts, bumperstickers, etc. In fact you should also copywrite “blusterf**ker,” or did I just do it?
Thanks for posting that Cory. Clearly, it’s Cotton’s first draft. The final shows heavy editing by the well named Cotton Club. (Jerry, is that yours?)
Jerry said, “between “jfk and khrushchev during the cuban missile crisis.” how about that in a cartoon, deb?”
I think that’s perfect, and I’m no cartoonist. Bill the Graphics Man?
Jana and Bill, I want to join you in loving “Blusterf**k”.That is The Best.
Donald, for all of your contributions here you can use “Blusterf**k” any time you want. Maybe we can have it as a community word to define…wait…what?
OK gang. We need a definition for “Blusterf**k”
Thinking of ‘posturing pols pissing platitudes profusely with no regard for consequences. See I start strong, but need some help…
Don Coyote’s says Kennedy was said to have said something to someone who told someone somewhere something about something. Is that clear? The last official wingnut word on Kennedy was he got away with murder and we’re glad the son of a bitch is dead.
https://twitter.com/VladaFoltan?original_referer=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.news.com.au%2Fworld%2Fis-president-vladimir-putin-dead-the-internet-certainly-thinks-so%2Fstory-fndir2ev-1227260905116&partner=tweetdeck&tw_i=576109340609916928&tw_p=tweetembed
With Putin out of the way,here is Israel’s next war for America.
Soon our own Tehran John, and the Cotton Club will be sending more messages to other mullahs defending his letter to his Iranian brethren about how wicked Obama is. We are becoming a joke in the international world with our lack of congress. By the way, what have they done besides vote 50 many times to eliminate Obamacare?
Tehran John? Outstanding Jerry! You are on a roll!
Thune and Rounds
Shiite and Shinola
Spoon and grounds
Smite and payola
Loon and clowns
Eat the crayola.
Atta boy Larry. These two gonifs are cartoons that supposedly represent us in Washington. It does not say to much for us who have sent them there or for Washington to have accepted them.
Larry, I wasn’t aware that you are such an accomplished poet. Thanks for sharing.
professional order of english majors at your service, ms. geelsdottir.
Ms. Geelsdottir, our good friend Lar has a lot of experience with what happens when you eat crayons and shiny wax fruit.
jerry, did you send rounds and/or thunethem there? if so, prepare for dicta-like harassment.
hey people-thats my copyright of the idea of these idiot’s letter being used in a cartoon depicting interference in jfk’s gunboat diplomacy with krushchev over the cuban missile crisis:)
grudz – is that your only idea so far on your boyz letter to iran?
Mike, you notice that Don Coyote resorts to a frequent tactic of the not-quite-listening Right Wing: trying to tack all of their old memes onto new debates to keep their fellows form having to think about the issue. We’re discussing a contemporary issue, and Don tries to turn it into an old debate about a Democrat that quite possibly no one in this room ever voted for.
Don resorts to these tactics because he can’t win a straight debate of the merits of Thune’s, Rounds’, and Cotton’s position.
No way would I have ever even considered that leslie. My vote was and is precious to me and that is why I voted for Rick because I know that he would not have tried to upend important talks with drivel. Tehran John was never a consideration even when he ran unopposed, how in the hell can that be? A stinker like him not drawing a taker. We need to find and ask for funding for someone to go against this turncoat. Even if defeated, make him pucker to answer for what he did. Maybe get one of his Ayatollah buddies to come to address the legislature in Pierre or Washington, for that matter, on what a fine fellow Tehran John is. Picture Tehran John with a wrap around his melon while wearing a robe.
i feel the same way and i’m from murdo, kinda
One thing that Murdo has going is certainly not Tehran John, it is the charging station. How cool is that? That is a way bigger deal for sure. When I go up and down that wide ole expanse of South Dakota, I see many things in the future. I would surely like to see rail come to Murdo from the East and then go further West with freight and passenger. The big plan would be to go South to service the Rosebud from there and then to Belvidere to service the Blackpipe area of the Rosebud, one of the poorest of the poor areas of South Dakota. To Kadoka and then South once again to the Pine Ridge. So you live in an area that I think could be great someday. It will never happen with Tehran John and the Cotton Club though, they have no vision.
i predict “tom cotton for president,” soon. this not in jest.
My proposed amendment (maybe a hoghouse) to Jana’s “blusterf**k” definition: platitude, puffery, pontification or position, offered up by posturing persons, usually politicians or a political party, that has many and massive unintended consequences, one of which is exposing the person, politicians and political party to blowback that includes near universal disgust and leads to popular humiliation and ridicule for offering up the platitude or position.
i always thought costner could have added to his rail plans from the airport to whitewood and deadwood by heading east on that pre-existing ROW to Interior, a spectacular tourist trip by rail any season, but as beautiful and wild (and someday maybe repopulated by buffalo herds) as the badlands remain, i am glad he didn’t. i would just as soon the harley’s don’t pollute them either.
THAT BEING SAID (as young people like to add to everything-but see how awkward it can be);
speaking of traitors, historically as i recall:
Gen. Harney, for whom the army named the lovely granite peak and spiritual center of everything [(“Our Black Hills”) copyright KOTA], hung 80 irish immigrant soldiers in spectacular fashion as TRAITORS in full view of Mexico City defense bastions, who all had apparently defected to the Mexican Army as loyal Catholics after landing at “Ellis Island” of the day from Europe, immediately conscripted in the US Army and shipped to the Mexican American War .
He did something similar with the Seminoles before he came out to the Blue Water in nebraska terr. and attacked the Brule’ and Oglala people in punishment for the Grattan “Massacre”, 1855. That midnight he stood on the banks of the Platte and shouted to his troops that they should kill every last one of them.
Aauhh, we love our republican traitors, and “we love our black hills, don’t we?!”
More and more signers by the thousands, to bring the Logan Act to Tehran John and the Cotton Club with more signing on each day. No matter what is said, Tehran John knows he stepped in a stinky pile of pooh that he may well have to answer for sometime on. He and Little John screwed up.
Tehran John and Little John should be registered with FARA as they have gone down that road. http://www.fara.gov/
An argument could surely be made regarding the Smith Act. We have plenty of those that would seek to destroy our country right around us here, we do not need to go to Washington the hear these two or see what the Cotton Club advocates with the Mullahs. America put this in place in 1940 just before the outbreak of World War Two and it speaks volumes of what we are witnessing. We damn sure do not want a World War Three, at least I don’t. Maybe our two conspirators want that, and should be asked exactly why they want to bring us all to that dance. http://www.bc.edu/bc_org/avp/cas/comm/free_speech/smithactof1940.html
I cant say I’m disappointed in the Flim Flam Insurance Man, or the life size hand puppet from Mudrow. To do so would infer that at one time I approved and such is not the case.
I haven’t done much posting for a while. After much reading and tv news I find myself thinking of the country like it is just a big old movie set. From thr front, everything looks ok, but behind the scenes everything is fake. Who knows, maybe its like the stock market and this is a self correction, but somehow I have my doubts.
I think there is a misconception about the GOP and for that mater a few on the Dems side of the isle. Some here claim that those people want to start a war. I dont think that is nesndsasarilly true, but they love money, and there is no doubt that the defense industry drives the countries economy. It is in the best financial interest to these contractors to keep tensions somewhat ellivated to keep the money train moving.
Dont get me wrong, they arent wanting war, but if a war is needed to keep the profits up it wont bother any of them to send someone else to get killed. To them, it is the price for doing business, nothing more.
It looks like the country is being run by fakes, controlled not by constituents, but by another country, Isreal. When I say the pledge, it doesnt say a damned thing about protecting Isreal because their stupid leaders think they are “the choosen ones.”
Ah hell its Friday, heres some Tim Wilson singing about fakes, Way Out In The Country.
http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=B8SPT87VxN8
The Blindman
Our new un-elected leader, Bibi Nutanyahooo, is about to be retired thanks to John Boner. Of course Tehran John and the Cotton Club helped push this squirrel over the cliff. Good riddance to him going over as Obama hands him an anvil. http://www.haaretz.com/news/israel-election-2015/1.646390
Thanks for Tim, Bill. It’s easy to see in this fantasy how “”Brother will betray brother to death, and a father his child; children will rebel against their parents and have them put to death.” Game on.
Indeed Les, if I were a fundamentalist puppet of any religion with gods hand up my butt controlling everything I was doing by pushing my prostate around, I could easily see how they could say the end of time.
The Blindman
Poor Netannumbnuts is concerned that outside forces are exerting too much influence in Israeli politics. Pot meet kettle.
Bibi’s support in America is dwindling, in a CNN poll released today he is down 4 points from just days ago.
I don’t know that the republicans and others indebted to Netanyahu and Israel have enough money to save his re-election.
It serve Boehner and the Cotton Club right if Bibi loses on Tuesday.
South Dakota’s own Kevin Woster questioned the wisdom of the letter signed by Thune and Rounds in a recent blog post over at KELOLAND. John Thune, or one of his staffers did get back to him and attempt to repair the damage they are obviously feeling…although not respecting the reporter enough to speack directly with him and take questions. Mostly standard party line patter from someone who won’t admit they made a mistake.
Here’s a thoughtful analysis from Michael Gerson, who MPR said if you’ve lost Gerson on this fight, you’ve lost the fight.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/a-half-baked-missive-from-the-gop/2015/03/12/ccf10b8e-c835-11e4-b2a1-bed1aaea2816_story.html
Yes Jana, Mutinous Tehran John and the Cotton Club are getting battered by the military as well. What a bunch of misfits that thankfully do not wear the uniform. http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/post-partisan/wp/2015/03/13/tom-cotton-picked-apart-by-army-general-over-mutinous-iran-letter/
Perhaps we should demand to see their birth certificates to see if they are in fact, something they claim to hate. Usually when you see folks that are so full of anger towards gender or religion is because they are that. We have seen it with the hate for gays and transgender folks so much so, that you wonder if those that hate are in the closet still. Makes me wonder about these 47 mutts.
Tehran John and the Cotton Club want Israel to do more of this. Ethnic cleansing of the Gaza. Get rid of the problem and Nutanyahoo can do as he pleases. This of course if courtesy of the American Tax Payer or as we are called, the mark. http://bigstory.ap.org/article/098f6f687f4e41a1a9b7387e515e6a66/ap-exclusive-high-civilian-death-toll-gaza-house-strikes
More blood and gore to satisfy the military industrial complex, but not quite enough American Blood for them to gorge themselves with. They need more cow bells and the only way to get that is a major conflict. Lovely. Ask your senator why they want to go to war? What is the their kickback for pushing into a killing field?
Jerry brings up a point that the media hasn’t asked yet. Does a “good agreement” with Iran include the threat of a “long term-boots on the ground unfunded war” commitment?
Just guessing that Kevin would ask John what a good agreement would entail…that is if John or Mike would ever call Kevin to explain their signatures.
Tike Mike Rounds and the Cotton Club made a pilgrimage to GTMO today: do you feel safer?
Larry, to be fair, they deserved a trip to the tropics after breaking the record of not voting to confirm an AG who has had zero push back.
Think of that one. John Thune loves Eric Holder so much that he, as a Senate leader, has delayed the confirmation of an appointee that has had no negative Senate reservations. Unless of course it is one or all of the below:
a) Female
b) Black
c) Obama derangement syndrome.
Your choices aren’t good here John because the only other choice is that you guys just don’t want to do your job!
Ah, but Jana, you see the Black Chess player already has the crackers figured out. He had Holder ready to leave his post for a replacement knowing full well that Tehran John and the Cotton Club will do whatever they can to not confirm a replacement. Obama laughs his ass off and Holder keeps on keeping on. Republican think tank strikes again! Funny, but sad.
wooster’s article, SD’s oldest tv reporter he smiles, has such a smarmy approach claiming he doesn’t like the letter but republishes and smooths it over with the state on account of rounds, noem and thune post-statements, or silence about the letter. he takes us back to 1979 showing how dems have asked for it by past acts. we all know here he doesn’t seem to know, as such an “old, wise “reporter that it goes back to nixon and reagan as well. don’t wanna rustle and SD red feathers. yuk
“game on” les sez after netanyahu and cotton’s letter.
that offends me.
les’ touchy feelings are hurt because of the WORLD-WIDE blowback against his 3 “stooges”. this is just this term’s GOP “obstruction dinner of 1.10.09” scorched earth strategy. les likes to say he is an independant thinker/voter and ALL republicans are not locked into party politics.
this blog’s informal motto applies here. pick a lane!
btw-this kind of sheit fits with the strategy of GOP state attorneys general orchestrated lawsuits against the administration (50 some in 2010).
1. obstruct everything except the 1%.
2. strategy to overwhelm by suing the administration ad nauseum at tax payers expense.
3. interfer w/ foreign policy twice in one week. more to come from this apparent new strategy.
GOP’S THREE LEGGED STOOL-
STOPPING DEMS AND DESTROYING THE MIDDLE CLASS.
WHY LES?
but HARDBALL’s chris matthews today just calls it as it is: GOP racism
http://billmoyers.com/2015/03/17/real-story-behind-republicans-iran-letter/
The Israeli owners of the United States and their American brethren control the banks, as well as our? congress. What they say, goes, simple as that. If you do not obey, you will find yourself unemployed without perks. When you are a good little boy or girl, the world opens to you in many ways. As this gent from Rome said some centuries ago:
“A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through…all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself.
For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murderer is less to fear. The traitor is the plague.” – Marcus Tullius Cicero
mfi-forgot to say, at 18:33 on the 12th, i was considering a serious response to coyote but yours is much more precise. thank u as always. funny, funny!
sorry don, please come back after cory gave u that a’ thrashin’!!
dems are having an important spring rise and we need you progressive liberal republicans to vote democratic. i am serious.
wow jerry, cicero’s “Rots the soul of a nation working secretly” fits the continuing GOP OBSTRUCTION’s SECRET DC diner agreement of 1.19.2009 against Obama, after crashing the country’s economy on 2008. this is happening now by SDGOP with Baby Rounds and Thune’s letter to IRAN & Noem’s post-statement of concurrence..
Racism and treason-nice mix don’t you think? Woster? any thoughts?
If the government in Israel continues to be successful in its corruption of our own government here, than we shall surely be in the same place as the Roman Empire that fell due to the same trickery. The longer we allow the corruption of someone like Mike Rounds and co signer Tehran John to be accepted, then the closer we get to falling over the cliff. While we are falling, do not expect Israel to pass us a parachute either, they will help us with an anvil. I just wonder why there are not more Synagogues being built here in South Dakota as there seems to be many converts to the following of ALEC as an example. Instead of Saint Patrick’s Day, we should be celebrating Hanukkah! Here are some recipes to prepare yourself: http://kosherfood.about.com/od/jewishholidaycooking/p/all_hanukkah.htm Mazel tov
larry-thx for the moyers link and aggressive posts at Dakota Progressive re: Daschle lobbying (hope he never gives lobbyist murphy a hand up into the big leagues) and re: lead’s leaks. good stuff as usual.
my pleasure, leslie.
There was a good article in today’s Strib about the difficulties this stupid Republican letter is creating in Sec. Kerry’s negotiations with Iran. Unfortunately, I can’t find it now.
Imagine, the American Congress sabotaging America’s foreign policy and America’s Secretary of State. That sure sounds like a criminally treasonous act to me.
Bibi wingnut played the race card yesterday in Israel,scaring like wingnuts with threats of too many Arab-Jew voters. Prolly saved his hide today.
Deb,
And sabotage is what this letter is about.
Damn good thing Tom Cotton was not in the senate when President Obama was hunting Bin Laden, Cotton probably have given Bin Laden a warning that President Obama was closing in.
Good call, Mr. Moyers!
Senator Thune just named Josh Shields his 2016 campaign manager. We need to hogtie Mr. Shields with the Cotton letter for the next 20 months (or maybe just the next 15, if we can convince Stace Nelson to come back and successfully primary Thune!).
Moyer’s article is chilling and it’s the result of Scalia and his cohorts approving wholesale bribery of American politicians. The American oligarchy is controlled by American and foreign Big Money.
Tehran John has $10,500,000.00 in his campaign war chest. That is a lot of shekels from his bosses. They are gonna invest whatever it takes to buy their golden boys vote. If you advertised each and every day, all day long on the tee vee here, you would never put a dent in that. But no matter how many of those ads that he hawks, the truth is Tehran John can be beaten once people wrap their heads around who that letter benefited. Once they realize that what he did was against all American interests both here and abroad, he may have a run in with a veteran that is tired of war and its consequences.
Daschle was a Nam Vet. Nobody said a word when they beat up on said vet. You gonna get involved next time Jerry?
daschle no longer a nam vet, then, les?
Naw les, it is not in my interests to defend Israel, they ain’t worth it to me. I prefer to sit this one out.
funny, Iran just announced it’s government intends to honor and not cheat on its commitment not to develop nuke weapons per negotiations with our President. what if the Iranian majority party of elected officials published an open letter to congress that such an agreement is only so good as, and as long as Iran’s president remains in office??????
after that all bets are off, kinda like the 47 GOP senators who wrote Iran a “treasonous” letter last week.
Perhaps Thune, Noem and Rounds could respond?????
The guy that Thune and Rounds are following like little puppies is saying that it would only take a couple of days to bomb Iran and get rid of their nukes…where have we heard that before?
Beuhler? Beuhler? Rumsfeld? Cheney? Thune? Rounds?
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2015/04/08/tom-cotton-iran-several-days_n_7026180.html