On Wednesday, I offered South Dakota’s three Electors ten reasons to dump Donald Trump on December 19. Today, Donald Trump himself gives them reason #11 to throw the bum out:
The President-Elect has just deemed his own election invalid. Trump has no evidence for this claim, but, just as he has sought to delegitimize the press and anyone else who questions his entitlement to wealth, power, and sex appeal, Trump is now attempting to delegitimize the votes of millions of Americans. Even in victory, Trump cannot resist the fascist urge he revealed in October to delegitimize the election process itself.
Don’t trust elections, cries the imminent dictator. Don’t trust voters. Don’t trust evidence. Don’t trust journalists. Don’t trust scientists. Don’t trust public schools. Trust me alone!
Donald Trump is promoting the destruction of faith in multiple American institutions. Donald Trump cannot be President. Dennis, Matt, Marty, cast your Electoral votes for someone else.
Trust, but verify. The recount requested by Green Party candidate Jill Stein is underway in Wisconsin. I kind of doubt it will change the Trump win here, but vote totals may shift. We have had a statewide recount in a state Supreme Court race. Totals did change by a few hundred votes, but not enough to affect that election outcome. However, there were far more votes cast in the Presidential election so who knows? Wisconsin could flip. Not likely, but possible.
We have a mix of two machine types, one without paper ballots. So, they will be looking for evidence of hacking in the one without paper ballots, and for correct totals based on paper ballots for the other. But Stein seems to be pointing more toward the absentee or early voting totals, rather than the vote coming from election day. I have been concerned about early voting totals, too, as it seems to be susceptible to shenanigans as the ballots sit around for weeks in some counties.
For a loud mouth who doesn’t want votes recounted, he sure sounds like someone begging to have his votes recounted. I say let’s give him what he so clerlywants.
What are the odds he has been told by his Russian buddies that they did hack certain state voting systems, after all, it is a fact his campaign had people with close ties to the Russians? Now he has to start screaming this again because he knows they may find something. If anything they find will be enough to flip the election is anybodies guess, I wouldn’t count on SD Republican electors to do the right thing, party before all else you know.
The Donald was so sure he was going to lose that he started the system is rigged and I won’t accept the results before the vote ever happened.
Now that he has won the electoral college, he’s still saying the system is rigged.
So far he has shown no interest in fixing a rigged system as long as its working for him.
these tweets are entertaining and enlightening and will likely dry up when this guy starts to do the job in the limited way he will likely pursue it. trump used to cackle about all the time Obama “squandered’ on the golf course. this bouffanted guy is either age challenged or spoiled rotten. remember the $400 haircuts the right attacked us for? I doubt Obama ever had one but its likely Trump has his own make-up and hair crew on-call, and we’ll eventually hear what that costs. the guy is just gonna wear out.
he doesn’t read, is that true, anyone? I thought he was educated at a business school. how did he pass?
republican leadership will surely have a system in place by January to gag these idiotic public statements. and, I like how Obama is gracious not to criticize Trump’s obvious dangerous behavior and work with him until inauguration. Trump couldn’t have a better teacher. Obama, the right president at the right time, he is the best thing that ever happened to this country.
Trump is now realizing how wrong he has been about Obama and those policies. it is unfortunate that the vipers in house and senate leadership will get the benefit of Obama’s taming their loose cannon. as usual it’ll take another 8 years of democratic or third party leadership to undo the deep trouble Trump is on the verge of creating.
Who knew when Trump said he would accept the election results if he wins that it was just another lie. He can’t even accept the election results when he wins.
I was ambivalent about a recount, but now I agree that we should have a complete recount. As MFI said, let’s give him what he wants.
And claiming that he won an electoral college landslide when he won by a two state margin is as straightforward and honest as his hairstyle.
I, for one, believe it is the hate that will destroy us as a country, Ms. leslie. The hate and vitriol that is sown by many.
What was the fuss with HRC’s emails. Drumpf talks to foreign leaders at Drumpf Tower without the benefit of secure phone lines and no official clearance from security.
This guy is a legitimate moron and not much else.
As it happens, I just completed reading David Newquist Northern Valley Beacon blog on language, liars and bull s—-ers.
Donald Trump has attacked the English language and given words a whole new meaning. He vacillates between a liar and a bull s—ter and as Dr. Newquist points out the bull s—-er is worse.
If Donald Trump had any redeeming presidential qualities he would ignore the recounts and not comment until they are completed.
leslie, Trump will never have the tact and diplomacy of President Obama. He was an ass two years ago and he’ll be an ass four years from now, if the republicans don’t replace him sooner.
point made by grudznick
Grudz, as HRC said, Trump took hate groups mainstream in this last election cycle.
What was the fuss with HRC’s emails? Um, there was classified information stored on and transmitted to/from a private, unauthorized server.
grudz- I recall the Obama hate registered here day after day for the last 8 years. I understand how you could say those things, educated by fox false news for years. remember your savior Glen Beck? Now your moron gets elected and you think my “hate” is going to take us all down. I don’t think so.
We have the benefit of better news sources than you. We are more connected to reality. Are you disturbed about Arctic warming at this moment? If you are not, and don’t understand it is likely the greatest problem facing our world right now, then you read like trump. https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2016/nov/25/arctic-ice-melt-trigger-uncontrollable-climate-change-global-level
right wing headlines today:
HILLARY CHALLENGES VOTING RESULTS…
ELECTORAL COLLEGE DELEGATES FACE DEATH THREATS…
THE DEMS’ REAL STRATEGY…
PRIEBUS SAYS SHE ‘CUT A DEAL’…
TRUMP: MILLIONS VOTED ILLEGALLY!
drudge and other angry spokespeople for the right, are regularly spewing disinformation about this and climate change not happening. I’ve been dealing with Jon. B Wells, radio personality for years now and despite all evidence he just keeps cranking up the fake rhetoric.
“not a puppet, not a puppet” trump barked. I don’t have to defend myself from you grudz. of course I am upset we are stupid enough to have elected trump.
The legitimacy of HRC’s name appearing on November ballots is questionable. Oh, the outrage.
Um, there was classified information stored on and transmitted to/from a private, unauthorized server.
Keep this in mind when the Drumpf reign of terror begins….wait, it already has. He has allowed his brats into meetings with foreign officials they have no security clearance for and have not been vetted for.
steve-do you really believe what you just said? we could parse what was or was not classified. what the law is with respect to classified info., the state of email “art” at the time, whether a private or a government server was required, whether it was a mere convenience for Hillary? Remember she used two (2) phones. have you ever used two phones. it can get confusing. in the explosion of digital devices during the time in question, why do you assume dastardly intention on the part of Hillary. How many times does she have to be investigated? Which investigation are you ever going to believe? Do you have any evidence that supports your “aw shucks” allegations. I didn’t think so? if you wanna go down to the mat on this issue i’ll assemble my side of the argument. otherwise your snide response is worthless.
Keep this in mind when the Drumpf reign of terror begins….wait, it already has. He has allowed his brats into meetings with foreign officials they have no security clearance for and have not been vetted for.
“Did Hillary Clinton give non-cleared people access to classified information?” Mr. Chaffetz asked.
“Yes,” Mr. Comey responded.
http://www.nytimes.com/live/james-comey-testifies-before-congress/did-clinton-provide-access-to-classified-documents-to-others/
Steve, you bring us the false equivalency again. The point here is that the winner and imminent President-Elect is calling into question the legitimacy of our democratic elections and other American institutions. He is laying the groundwork to do what the right alleged evil Marxist Obama would do: call of future elections and install himself as dictator for life.
Those who dismiss the consensus of science often have to claim that the peer-review process — in a massive conspiracy among the world’s scientists — is systematically suppressing “climate skeptics,” rather than weeding out misleading papers, because so few peer-reviewed scientific papers support their claims.
Drudge is right about one thing: this is an “Echo of Climategate” — a private communication from a scientist is being taken out of context to try to discredit the extensive science demonstrating the risks of man-made climate change.
The Times, a British newspaper owned by Rupert Murdoch, suggests that because a paper by the University of Reading’s Lennart Bengtsson was not published in a prestigious scientific journal, politically motivated suppression is behind the “cover-up.” …the draft paper was not published because it “contained errors” and “did not provide a significant advancement in the field.” Top journals typically reject about nine out of ten papers submitted — it is not a “cover-up” but a standard practice to accept only the papers that most advance the field.
http://mediamatters.org/blog/2014/05/16/drudge-promotes-global-scientific-conspiracy/199355
More false equivalency, Steve: Clinton conducted government communications on a private server. Trump intends to conduct the Presidency in his private skyscraper.
Ms. leslie, you are wrong again. I dislike that Glen Beck fellow. Stop the hate.
Steve Sanchez, give it a rest.
Even Dumb Dumb Trump has recognized that there is no basis for further investigation or prosecution, or so he says.
But the way he lies he could bring it up again if he has a bad day and is on Twitter.
Steve, I won’t cast aspersions on President elect Donald Trump, but could you let us know what his relationships are with the Russia?
Would love to know what banking relationships he has with Putin’s state controlled banks and those of Putin’s satellite countries. I’m sure we’ll learn more when he releases his tax returns! Wait…what?!?!? He won’t release them?
You remember Russia, Ronald Reagan distrusted them and they are alleged to have spread false news and assisted your guy the Donald in America’s election. But hey, we all know that Russia has always had our best interests at heart. Not to mention, Putin looks hot without his shirt on riding a horse or wrestling a bear. What a stud for the right wing to admire and look up to.
Keep us posted on what the real news is…thanks.
steve-“Secretary Clinton used several different servers and administrators of those servers during her four years at the State Department, and used numerous mobile devices to view and send e-mail on that personal domain. As new servers and equipment were employed, older servers were taken out of service, stored, and decommissioned in various ways. Piecing all of that back together—to gain as full an understanding as possible of the ways in which personal e-mail was used for government work—has been a painstaking undertaking, requiring thousands of hours of effort.
…our judgment is that no reasonable prosecutor would bring such a case.” THAT’S THE FINAL WORD
https://www.fbi.gov/news/pressrel/press-releases/statement-by-fbi-director-james-b-comey-on-the-investigation-of-secretary-hillary-clinton2019s-use-of-a-personal-e-mail-system
if u need this updated to Republican FBI Chief Comey’s “11 day prior to election release” which said the same thing pretty much… I can go look it up for you.
so basically u r wasting our time hanging on drudge/rush/fox et al’s misstatements when u said above :
“Um, there was classified information stored on and transmitted to/from a private, unauthorized server.”
stupid , huh. and then u step your other foot in it suggesting Hillary was not legitimately on the ballot. trump lost that one 8 years ago alleging Obama was not a US citizen, but u bring it up again, now, based on what evidence? Bernie/Wasserman-Schultz? What? I didn’t think so.
freaking republicans. have fun for four years. hope you won’t need health care. I do. who knows if i’ll still have coverage after January when you people start monkeying with a system that is so massive and so important that your one- liner solutions won’t work. you’ll find that out, to the the rest of our grief.
fact-based knowledge–what a concept? Not at fox news though.
I’m reading a lot of “false equivalency”, but nowhere do I see “what you have written is incorrect.” I’m not promulgating opinion here.
I’m not a Republican, leslie.
During the campaign, Trump kept saying that the election was rigged. I guess he was right, except it was rigged in his favor:
http://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-election-russia-trump-idUSKBN1351RJ
Add this news story to concerns that the election outcomes in certain counties in WI, MI, and PA are statistical abnormalities given the trends in the rest of the state, the type of electronic voting machines that were used there, and historic trends and you have the makings of the perfect fix or rigging of an election.
Not to mention Putin’s interest towards backing rightist campaigns through the western world in order to create a great divide within the west, which overtime can create the perfect example of a real foreign invasion that we should all be concerned about as Americans regardless of our partisan beliefs….:
http://foreignpolicy.com/2016/02/23/why-europe-is-right-to-fear-putins-useful-idiots/
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2016-03-15/putin-s-hand-grows-stronger-as-right-wing-parties-advance-in-europe
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/russia/12103602/America-to-investigate-Russian-meddling-in-EU.html
Steve, please continue…
But if Hillary was wrong, does that give the Donald the permission to do the same?
I can only imagine your outrage if he exposes state secrets to others…or if his kids use that classified information to negotiate deals with foreign countries.
But that couldn’t happen…right?
And I’m pointing out, Steve, that the facts about your claims about Clinton are subordinate and irrelevant to the point at hand, that the President-Elect is actively undermining the legitimacy of the election process.
Don’t let Steve take you off-topic, people. This post is about what Donald Trump is doing, right now, today, as he coasts toward possession of the nuclear codes.
Jana,
To your first question: No!
Answer to your second question: Yes. And, I would be outraged.
Steve, let the outrage begin…unless you don’t think that President elect Trump has any conflict of interests. But then no one who is rational doesn’t believe he has conflicts that need to be buffered and monitored…right?
Hey, how are the millions he owes to foreign banks going to be monitored? Do you think his kids won’t use their inside knowledge and influence to make sure that the foreign interests of the Trump empire aren’t going to be profitable…no matter what the national security interests are?
Oh what the heck, he won fair and square and the majority of the US citizens voted for him…wait…what?!? Thank God he pointed out that the system is rigged.
How bad is it? This gent, Trump, lies even when he doesn’t have to! Republicans, he’s YOUR guy. Anyone want to stand up to this bull roar? {Crickets!!!!}
When you cannot trust what the president is saying, the financial markets get nervous. Of course, who pays attention that that old thing?
No tax returns, no problem, if the president does it, no law is broken. How many of these trails do we go down? http://www.latimes.com/opinion/op-ed/la-oe-mcmanus-trump-ethics-20161127-story.html
What happens when a Trump property gets destroyed? How many troops from the 82nd Airborne will be activated for this attack on his personal property? Guess that is okay with Mr. Sanchez, right?
Hillary Clinton’s lead in the popular vote is now over 2,235,000
http://cookpolitical.com/story/10174
Hang in there Steve! The only reason this, um, discussion is taking place is because a strong, clear thinking, woman of integrity, i.e. Jill Stein is poking the bear, i.e. THE ESTABLISMENT, and justifiably wants to make sure that our elections have the full faith of Americans in order to restore our faith in our institutions. She also happens to be the strongest national political opponent of the Dakota Access Pipeline along with Bernie Sanders. Go figure, a couple of politicians who care about THE PEOPLE! It’s a miracle.
As always, Trump is showing his insanity, thin skin and unfitness for office. I also hope that our SD electors do the right thing!
I hear the Democrats are doing a “listening” tour. I’d call it a shouting tour.
Here is Jill Stein’s petition, with supporting documents, for a recount of the presidential vote in the State of Wisconsin. The supporting documents are very interesting. The recount will likely tell us if, indeed, the election was rigged.
http://elections.wi.gov/sites/default/files/news/wisconsin_recount_petition_of_jill_stein_00268242_12391.pdf
A DRAFT DODGER FOR ANOTHER PRESIDENT
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CxfR2fqW8AAf2h_.jpg
Exit polling has HRC winning Wisconsin, Floriduh, North Carolina and Pennsylvania. Oh OH.
https://jillstein.nationbuilder.com/recount
Interesting, Donald Pay. The supporting documents to the Stein petition show the Russians hacked the Ukrainian election:
“If it had not been discovered and removed, the malicious software would have portrayed ultra-nationalist Right Sector party leader Dmytro Yarosh as the winner with 37 percent of the vote (instead of the 1 percent he actually received) and Petro Poroshenko (the actually winner with a
majority of the vote) with just 29 percent, Ukraine officials told reporters the next morning.
Curiously, Russian Channel One aired a bulletin that evening declaring Mr. Yarosh the victor with 37 percent of the vote over Mr. Poroshenko with 29 percent, Ukraine officials said.”
Christian Science Monitor, June 17, 2014
So, Russian state TV had the Ukranian results matching the hacked number that no one knew except for the hackers and the election officials who discovered the hack.
I wonder how long into the Trump presidency “bu-but-CLINTON!” will be trotted out before the most powerful elected official in the world is judged on his own merits and failures.
Hes not draining the swamp, hes pumping more sewage in the lagoon.
The Blindman
Donald, I have a little trouble getting worked up over the contents of Stein’s petition. She and computer security expert Halderman offer no evidence specific to Wisconsin. They are not presenting evidence of mistakes or tricks in the Wisconsin count; they are asking Wisconsin to go look for mistakes and errors based on the general evidence of Russian hacking with intent to interfere in the U.S. election. The supporting document (a.k.a. article copied from the Web) Darin highlights about Russia’s attempt to hack Ukraine’s election shows Russia has the means. The other Web articles in the exhibits establish that Russia had the opportunity. A brief reading of recent history and foreign policy establishes motive. But not one exhibit establishes clear opportunity in Wisconsin, and not one exhibit offers evidence of effort to realize that opportunity.
Mike, similarly, I can’t get excited about the chart you present on exit polls versus vote results. The exit polls were off nationwide, not just in those key states. If there’s hacking involved, they went far and wide, and even swayed some states more toward Clinton to cover their tracks.
Of course, exit polls appear to be off every election, suggesting an ongoing election fraud that goes beyond the specifics of Russian hacking alleged in the Stein affidavit.
And Stein, while offering no evidence of specific shenanigans in Wisconsin, still offers more circumstantial evidence to support her call for an investigation to ensure all votes are counted correctly than Trump offers to support his argument for throwing out the votes of millions of Americans.
I don’t have a problem with legal recounts, but I’m not naïve enough to believe this will have any impact upon the final results.
If someone is smart enough and capable enough to “hack” or manipulate election results (something we have no evidence to support at this time), surely they could do the same during a recount.
What I do have a problem with are the electronic voting machines. It isn’t about Democrat vs. Republican vs. any other party – it is about integrity of the system. We should mandate that all voting machines be offline and not connected to any public network (thus reducing ability for a remote party to modify the results). We should also mandate receipts be printed with unique codes which could show the way someone voted. Receipts can be compared during random audits to ensure the recorded result mirrors what the person actually entered.
We also need more monitoring of elections. They tell us we shouldn’t worry and that everything is on the up and up, but every time we see a recount of any magnitude we find thousands and thousands of votes that were miscounted. I understand humans make mistakes, but if you have a person who makes a mistake, there should be a few other people involved who are able to catch that mistake. To think we don’t notice these mistakes until months later (if ever) is concerning.
Putin has a long record of this election fraud, guess who pissed him off at home? http://www.nytimes.com/2011/12/06/world/europe/russian-parliamentary-elections-criticized-by-west.html
How it is done http://fpc.state.gov/documents/organization/179577.pdf
I think hillary unmasked because she is tired after a long race and wants to show America what misogyny looks like. Guys like sanchez can look into those eyes and question why they bought that emails were illegal and voted against her. Because republicans hoped you’d believe A Crooked Hillary campaign. You bought it. Republicans do this year after year. Republican Fbi Dir Comey repeated the email allegation 11 DAYS before the election, focus on association with wenier, and trump knew confusing angry disenfranchised middle class blue collars he could siphon their vote from a higher knowledge majority.
You can’t manipulate paper ballots once they are out of the machine and stored properly. Wisconsin refuses to do a full hand count and are being sued because of it.
The name of the game by wingnuts is to run the clock down to Dec 13th when the recounts have to be done and a winner declared.
Pa says recount deadline passed and they will be sued as well.
Ah, Craig, according to Stein’s computer security expert Halderman, offline voting machines can still be hacked via virus. Vote counting software has to come from somewhere to that offline machine; if the county auditor downloads that software from an online vendor or even transfers that software from machine to machine in the office, hackers have opportunities to introduce viruses.
I maintain that Stein’s recount call is based on thin evidence (none specific to Wisconsin). But more importantly, Trump’s declaration of millions of illegal votes not only lacks evidence but runs counter to all available evidence.
Still, as Mike says, we have paper ballots. If we’re serious about beating hackers, we can go back to counting those ballots by hand. Unfortunately, hand counts can be off by 2%.
Cory, how would a person provide direct evidence that the Wisconsin vote totals were hacked without calling for a recount and getting access to the computer files and verifying vote totals match machines and hand counts and that there is no evidence of the files being hacked?
1) Get a Russian computer hacker to admit he hacked the election. Right, that person would die a slow horrible death from radiation sickness courtesy of Putin’s FSB if they turned snitch. They are in Russia and they are not talking.
2) hack the computers with voting information on them yourself and then monitor the software for hacking by a third party. Umm, this is quite illegal and practically speaking, impossible, so this is not an option.
Thus, the motive, opportunity and past desire of the Russians to influence elections have to be sufficient to serve as the basis for a recount. This should be more of a reasonable suspicion standard for a recount rather than proof beyond a reasonable doubt or even probable cause, especial with the requirement that the challenger pay for the recount.
Plus, I’d get an affidavit from Trump claiming the millions of illegal voters that he knows voted. :-)
You know he’s going to shoot off a nuke, just to know what it feels like.
True, Darin, hard evidence doesn’t come without looking at the ballots. And, at least in South Dakota, we don’t need evidence to call for a recount; we just have to point at a margin within 2% and shout, “Recount!”
That said, Stein and Halderman could point to Wisconsin-specific data that could serve as circumstantial evidence for alarm, like exit polls not aligning with the outcome, or anomalous vote totals.