We know how this plays out: a Muslim South Dakotan exercises Second Amendment rights to the extreme peddled by the right wing…
A man who was asked to leave an anti-Islam speaking event last week after he held up the Quran and was believed to have weapons on his person will not face charges in connection with the incident, a Sioux Falls Police Department spokesman said Monday.
…Sam Clemens, a spokesman with the Sioux Falls Police Department, said security officers at the event believed the man had a weapon at the event and asked him to leave. Clemens said the man left the Hilton Garden Inn South and went to his car.
At that point the man voiced his concern about the tenor of Hadian’s talk titled “Sabotaging America: Islam’s March Towards Supremacy” using Facebook Live. In the video the man pulls out multiple handguns, a shotgun and ammo, which he had in his vehicle. In the video the man curses and says, “be scared,” as he shows the weapons.
Clemens said police and FBI agents met with the man at the event and later on in the evening to verify that he posed no harm to event attendees. Concealed carrying a firearm is legal with a permit in South Dakota, though private business owners can restrict possession in their establishments.
“Everything he was doing was legal. He didn’t break any laws so we didn’t charge him,” Clemens said. “It would have been a different story if he had threatened anybody” [Dana Ferguson, “Man Who Carried Weapon at Anti-Islam Event Won’t Face Charges,” that Sioux Falls paper, 2017.04.17].
…and the right-wing-o-sphere freaks out:
A Muslim man entered a private gathering of Christians in a hotel ballroom in South Dakota, started cursing and livestreaming video on Facebook of the event and then, after he was ushered out, displayed multiple firearms and issued statements the speakers say were a direct threat to their safety.
…“I do believe the off-duty police officer who noticed what was going on is a hero who may have stopped a potential attack,” said Brannon Howse, who was on the podium speaking when Jaber was asked to leave [Leo Hohmann, “Heavily Armed Muslim Warns U.S. Public: ‘Be Terrified’,” World Net Daily, 2017.04.17].
Ehab Jaber has displayed his weapons and rhetoric on Facebook for some time:
Rather than covering his tracks, Jaber is keeping his Facebook page public and displaying his gun pride as unashamedly as Stace Nelson, Jordan Mason, and other South Dakota gun owners. Jaber offers this lengthy response to the white noise (out of Internet politeness, I take the liberty of de-capitalizing what appears on his page in all caps):
dear visitor,
i’m sure by now, you probably have seen the picture or video and you’re checking out my fb profile. welcome. relax. it’s not what you think. believe me or not, it’s up to you. i am almost 46. sioux falls has been my home for the last 24 years. as a matter of fact, sioix falls has been home since before i was even born. i am an american. so any call for deportation is just not gonna happen, even with trump in the white house. 80% of my friends are christians. you know what the other 20% is?
athiests!!!
i’ve served you and your family, food and drink. i’ve watched over your teenagers when they came to the club for teen night. all common sense says, deactivate my page. shut it down. damage control. buT alas, i’ve done nothing wrong. justlike the fbi detectives told me already. i have nothing to hide. so go ahead, take the fb free tour. if this fb page is no longer up, know that i did not deactivate it. the shirt i’m wearing in the video, i have worn out before many times. some of you might have seen me at huhot wearing the same shirt or a pink one, with my .45 calliber kimber ultra carry stainless…. i know, very nice pistol… some of you might have seen me while getting their hair cut at the mansalon. some might have seen me at walmart or hyvee. and many of you have seen me at the gun range, with my entier arsenal. it’s not for you. i armed myself against stupidity and against what might become one day an oppressive government. because come hell or high water, this american who happens to be a muslim, ain’t getting on no bus and ain’t going to no camp. the double negatives are intentional. to appeal to some in the crowd. if you set out to harm my son or anyone i love, bare in mind, 80% of which are christians, i will do what any of you would do in that case. you will also quickly find out how dillusional and paranoid you are. my fb page is open to you. and will open up my home to you if you want to have a conversation. but stupidity will be met with absolute intolerance to it.
love peace and chicken grease
don’t fall victim to fear. there is no dignity in fear [Ehab Jaber, Facebook post, 2017.04.17].
Jaber posted this video live from inside the April 9 event (caution: foul language), where the man who asked him to leave expresses more concern with the fact that Jaber was pointing his camera at the crowd than that he was carrying a firearm:
Jaber posted last week that two federal agent questioned him last week. I’d post that note and others, but Jaber uses too many f-bombs for DFP posting, and I don’t feel like doing more editing.
I maintain as I have in previous discussions that carrying around that many weapons serves little good and much ill. Both the carrier and the people around him are in greater danger of being shot than if the carrier’s guns were not present. That’s why I oppose guns in the Capitol, in courthouses, and in classrooms. If I see Jaber at Huhot with his pistol, I’ll tell him that gun isn’t going to protect him from the biggest threat he faces at that moment, the Five Village Fire Szechuan sauce.
But Jaber is expressing the same misguided armed response to fear and objectionable politics as South Dakota’s avid gun advocates:
Shooting things is a bad solution. Carrying guns and thus threatening to shoot things signals a failure of imagination and faith in civil society. If anyone had shown up at the anti-xenophobia protest here in Aberdeen a couple weeks ago, I suspect organizers would have told the gun-toters to beat it.
But if “Gunny Granny” can show that bad faith and bring her guns from home, why can’t Ehab Jaber? I can offer you a consistent response as to why Granny and Ehab ought to put down their weapons and seek more civil interaction with their neighbors. South Dakota’s white-wing gun nuts cannot. Whatever the Second Amendment covers, it applies equally to white Christian grannies and brown Muslim cooks.
p.s.: By the way, Daily Caller reports that the April 9 anti-Islam event featured a speech on “The Growing Global Persecution of Christians,” in which radio host Brannon Howse said that “Islamic Centers, Neo-Marxists, Neo-Evangelicals, the Vatican and globalists are working together to subvert our immigration laws and transform America.” The Vatican? Dang—maybe Catholic bloggers Pat Powers and Troy Jones should be up in arms at this attack on their religion.
The Pam Geller site came up on my Google newsfeed this morning, for some bizarre unknown reason.They are claiming that South Dakota has separate laws for Muslims and Christians and Sharia law is being enforced in South Dakota.
Meanwhile in Sioux Falls, irresponsible gun owners have allowed 6 guns and ammunition to be stolen over the weekend from their unlocked cars. No skin off their patooties, right? Insurance will cover it for them. Who cares what the guns might be used for by the criminals who so easily lifted them or the criminals who buy them on the cheap.
Maybe responsible gun owners in the legislature should pass a law making it a class 2 misdemeanor to leave a gun in an unlocked, unoccupied car.
Like it or not, this gentle gun owner just kicked the NRA whitey wingnuts in the privates and I loved it. Bout time they got what they had coming from a gun fanatic.
Not sure if this advances the conversation about too many guns in too many places, but I don’t bother myself with small details.
Says a lot about why some bearded, white guy with a beer gut, strolling thru a Texas WallMart with an AR strapped across his chest is considered “cool” while the same person of the black, native or Asian persuasion is considered a threat. It’s called “selective amendment application”! We Americans are getting pretty good at it!
Ror, I’m inclined to agree that there ought to be a penalty for leaving a gun lying around where someone else can grab it. Of course, one could argue that having the gun stolen is sufficient penalty… but I can’t condone theft any more than I can condone irresponsible gun handling and storage.
I don’t care whether Ehab or a white Walmart shopper does it: walking around with a gun in public just to intimidate others or flaunt one’s “rights” is uncool, unsafe, and unnecessary.
Snaillady: Sharia in South Dakota? My goodness, where does Pam Geller get her info? I hesitated to pursue the story when I saw Pat Powers citing Pam Geller as his primary source. But I do see that Geller misrepresents the story saying Jaber was neither arrested nor questioned. The original Ferguson article cited above indicates that SF police and the FBI questioned Jaber the evening of the event.
Shades of the Black Panthers in Sacramento long ago, eh ?
Buckobear, maybe we need a corps of “Pink Panthers”—liberal ladies wearing their pink protest caps and carrying AK-47s everywhere they go to emphasize their point.
But no, that’s the last thing I want—every disputant showing up to every protest with a gun in her or his hand.
Powers over at the Dump Site calls this anti-Islam gathering a Christian conference, if that gathering of haters are Christian I don’t want to be one.
This ahem…kristian group is on SPLCs list of hate groups and one of the SooFoo speakers is an ex-Muslim turned kristian minister named something Hadian.
It is clear this guy did not break any gun laws and more power to him for enacting those gun rights. But was anyone taken back by what he was saying on the Facebook live videos? I would not want to be at any event where this guy was in the parking lot with 7 guns and ranting about people needing to be scared. On his FB it says he has Christian friends, doesn’t the Koran say he should hate those people? What was also bothersome is when he talked about serving our kids on teen night, whatever that means it was somewhat disturbing. I wonder if some of what he says is borderline threatening? At least Free Press is reporting on this, couldn’t find any information on Keloland and the Argus is just terrible.
why isn’t the right wingers defending this American and his right to carry?
Oh wait he’s a Muslim. I’m bad
Cory,
I’m going to need something out of the Tip Jar if you expect me to keep responding to your dog whistles.
This is free:
Your neighbors are holding Klan meetings and what is the issue? A man with a gun… and a brown man to boot. Now switch things around, it’s an anti-gay meeting and a homosexual with a gun shows up to protest. Would Cory devote the whole post to the gun bearing aspect of the issue, or the dangers of LGBT racism?
If this man reads your masterpiece that almost totally ignores his points while focusing on his guns, is he shocked to see “liberals” and “Conservatives” ignoring racism and ginning up fear of “others” together? Ignoring and dismissing peoples’ concerns is a guaranteed recipe for frustration and elicits actions that are more shocking. People don’t drive trucks through crowds because they think they are being heard and too many are paying attention to the issue of racism.
Dog whistle? I didn’t hear anything….
Please, Barry, don’t argue hypotheticals. Argue what’s actually happening. Gun nuts tell us they want guns everywhere. A Muslim man takes them up on their beliefs, and the gun nuts now scream lock him up! What’s up with that?
Ammosexuals come in all shapes sizes and religions. Maybe now the paleface ammos know what it’s like to be in fear of them.
A search of his name brings up an article at the Daily Caller with two short videos he created. Of course he has the same rights as anyone, but he is very agitated in the videos and appears a bit unstable. He’s a bit scary. Watch the two videos.
But Islam stinks! As does any fundamentalist religion or way of thinking, including Regressive Liberalism. Had to get that in, but it is important to remember criticizing ideas, like Islam is not discrimination. Islam is not a race. He thinks those books are dumb and garbage that’s fine too. Our free speech is how we learn and grow, but the load of guns he has to intimidate and scare people (watch the videos) is not cool.
http://dailycaller.com/2017/04/17/conservative-conference-threatened-by-heavily-armed-muslim-man/
Whitefish, Montana
Track the guy down Cory. Do an interview or a podcast. Ask him why he hates those books they are selling so much. Tell him you are an atheist. He has freedom of speech but it appears all he wanted to do was scare people rather than say something meaningful. Find out why he’s so angry ask him some tough questions. Do some podcasts!
Happy,
Why don’t you track the guy down and interview him, what is holding you back?
I’d like to keep my gay head on my happy little shoulders.
Why would you feel compelled to tell him you are gay?
I’m not being literally serious, but am sympathetic to fellow gays and atheists who must live around fundamentalists (he appears to be one), especially in the Muslim world.
So I guess Ehab and the ROP would be ok with me hanging out at the mosque with a Bible and a gun?
Charles Ridge the Christian Charles Ridge.
I happen to be watching a good interview with Dave Rubin (gay Jew), Lalo Dageth (Palestinian atheist), and Gad Saad (Lebanese Jew). They are talking about just how difficult it is for them to be so open about who they are, and how little most of us in the west have to risk but we still choose to be anonymous, so I do appreciate that Cory puts his neck out literally, even though I do think he is completely on the wrong side of this argument. For some of these people however it’s not theoretical, they have lived through it: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WjvQTsNwNTA
I guess that depends, Charles: is the mosque private property? Are you going to enter private property with your weapon? Are you going to remain with your weapon even if asked to leave? Are you going to do anything with your weapon that Jaber did not?
I can’t tell you what Jaber or anyone else (ROP?) would think. But I can tell you I would think you are wasting your time and behaving stupidly, just like Jaber was toting his bang-bangs around.
The Lord is my shepherd I shall not want-why do you want to carry a gun or a bible?
If your faith is strong, shouldn’t it turn bullets or is that all B.S.?
This video link shows how difficult it is to leave Islam, even in London. The first man was beaten, multiple broken bones, car smashed multiple times. The stories are horrible, so to what extent are these values imported? How should we be helping them rather than pretending there are no risks or differences. As always public debates and crusaders can no doubt attract people like Ami Horowitz who misrepresent/exaggerate, but even the comment section is interesting. Like:
Believe that if you are born in Islam you’re family will shun you in America even if that means you face homelessness Islam is the only thing that will make you their blood. I will leave Islam one day and shout to everyone whoever knew me that I no longer follow.
I used to be an apostate now I’ve come back to the deen,death to all you apostates in the comment section Allahu Akbar
Well she says “in Saudi Arabia I dreamt about walking in the streets alone. With no neqab”! Ok, I’m a 15 year old boy in Saudi Arabia and I don’t walk alone in the streets even though it’s pretty safe. How about a girl with no neqab, what do you expect to happen to her. That’s for her own safety. Sadly she’s too dumb to realize that…
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O1lnxUXWGgE
Happy, how do you feel when someone calls you a fag? Don’t be tough for the audience. Educate the hate filled Cory and Jenny about name calling and its effect on self-esteem.
Would you feel comfortable confronting a group of people who advocated deporting and killing fags? …and I use that word purposely as you know inside that meeting, they were using those kinds of names for Muslims.
Now imagine you are bravely confronting a gathering of bigots all by yourself, you would have a baseball bat or some other weapon in your car as you were thinking yourself crazy for even going.
So you go, you get ejected and rousted by several layers of LE, then the “lIberal” press headline reads: “Religious Dick Nut Makes Anti-Gay Crowd Nervous About Dicks”.
LOOK OUT! He has a BBC
(big black colt)
Cory, you should interview the man. You need the education as this post reveals you to be an ignorant, hate filled bigot who will ignore important matters to further your own agenda on guns. Pushing the Gay lifestyle and hating guns does not a liberal make. There is much more to it. When you interview him, make sure to emphasize the Nut part of Gun Nut. Or are you only forthright and brave from behind your keyboard?
happy makes arguments that we should fear Muslims based on you tube videos and anecdotal stories supporting such fear mongering.
But if you look at Pew research on the attitudes of various religious groups here in the USA you might be surprised to find that Muslims generally support helping people as much or more than other Christian groups.
happy says he fears Muslims based on their opinions about homosexuality. The Pew study suggests happy’s fears are misplaced. In 2014 it reports that 45% of American Muslims “say that homosexuality should be accepted by society.” Comparatively, only 36% of Christian evangelicals and Mormons would accept homosexuality, while only 16% of Jehovah’s Witnesses support it. The survey on support for gay marriage has similar results. This suggest that happy has more to fear from America’s evangelicals, Mormons and Jehovah’s Witnesses than Muslims.
http://www.pewforum.org/2015/11/03/chapter-4-social-and-political-attitudes/
This is really an informative and enlightening survey of attitudes. As an atheist/secular humanist I find my views more aligned on most topics with Muslim attitudes than with Christian reported viewpoints, primarily because Muslims seem to care more about their fellow human beings.
The thing is Barry, I’m not entirely sure what point you want to make. Fag is a hurtful word, it was very punishing and damaging, but I don’t know why Ehab Jaber was so angry and what was said to him inside. Was he just rattled or is he unstable? But scaring people doesn’t help, isn’t productive, and most of us are ignorant about Islam, which is a broad practice, and not that simple to describe.
It’s sounds sophisticated (or at least not ignorant) to say all monotheistic religions all worship the same god and are really about the same, but I want to know the truth about it, because some Muslims themselves who want to leave the faith are afraid, more or less depending on their specific set of circumstances. Their family, the country they live (or lived), to the point some apostates are killed. I feel Cory (and some commenters) are too certain they know things we’ve never experienced or been exposed, and that it’s intellectually dishonest to not discuss the differences and risk, but not ignorantly.
This man, Muhammad Syed (in the link below), is the president of Ex-Mulsims of North America. He gives what I think is a very sincere interview with Seth Andrews, so I think it’s credible. It stands to reason that if some Muslims themselves are afraid when they want to leave Islam, then there is some basis for concern when their fears are being realized in places that are pluralistic in the west, and not just in those most fundamentalist places like Saudia Arabia, Pakistan, etc.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xDIR3GhXszo
And I might add, that if anecdotes are a valuable tool for determining attitudes of Muslims, every single Muslim I have ever personally known or interacted with (there have been many!) has exhibited peaceful and respectful attitudes toward myself and others, whether Muslim or not.
Unfortunately, I cannot say the same about many Christian evangelicals I have encountered, although Mormons and Jehovah’s Witnesses have always acted respectful of me and others in our meetings (usually through discussions as they attempt to convert me).
Hold the phone BCB I didn’t cherry pick, just did a search for Ex-Mulsim. Their stories are completely relevant and powerful I encourage everyone to do this, on the other hand DFP is a Bias Factory. Anytime you want confirmation come out here, read what makes you feel good along with a like-minded comment section, other than that occasional pest which gives you the added joy of giving them a swat. Mikey loves it!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vYEXzx-TINc
“I am an enemy of God, enemy of religion, enemy of caste and enemy of all blind beliefs. But I am not an enemy of humans who believe in humanity.”
That was one of the last posts an Ex-Muslim atheist made before being hacked to death last month by a gang of four.
The police cited that one of the reasons for murder was a photo that he shared in the Whatsapp group where one of his children was seen holding a placard with the handwritten slogan “Kadavul illai, Kadavul illai, Kadavul illai (No God, No God, No God)”.
The religious believers thought Farooq raising his children as atheists threatened Islam.
https://thelogicalindian.com/story-feed/awareness/h-farooq/
When your attempts to foster fear toward Muslims are met with contrary objective facts, it doesn’t help your case to dodge and weave by demeaning and insulting Cory or his commentators on his blog.
Why not fear the criminals and abusers who commit atrocities instead of innocent people who happen to share a similar religious label, but have never harmed a soul. Painting with a overbroad brush that includes more innocent folks than criminals and abusers creates a distorted picture of reality that is too often used by bigots to harm innocent Muslims.
Incidentally, in all of your rants against Muslims, I don’t recall your suggested remedy. If you were king of the world, what would you do with the estimated 2.2 billion Muslims in the world? Gas them? Inter them in camps? Lock them up?
You are not king, but you preach fear of Muslims, so you must have a goal. Are you hoping to increase hatred and discrimination against Muslims here in the USA? Maybe enact laws outlawing the religion and jailing those who will not give it up? Are you hoping to gin up support for a war against Muslim nations? What public policies do you hope to accomplish if your anecdotes and videos from Muslim critics establish that Muslims are a danger and must be feared?
On the other side of the coin, when you read anti-Muslim rants and watch anti-Muslim videos, have you considered the motives of the authors of these rants that purport to spread the truth about the evils of Muslims? Money? Jailing Muslims? Starting wars?
Oh no BCB, I was thinking this afternoon how important the difference is between Peace Loving Muslims and Radical Islam. Peace Loving Muslims are not the problem though I would ridicule any belief system where they worship gods.
But again I think because “liberals” are so eager to condemn the harsh criticisms of Islam, it also puts Moderate Muslims at a disadvantage to criticize Radical Islam. The left ends up protecting the most illiberal elements. Many of the Ex-Muslims are dismayed that western liberals do not support them, or even call them bigots for trying to accurately describe the problems with Fundamentalist Islam, like forced marriage or Female Genital Mutilation.
Do your own search for Ex-Muslims.
But as far as criticizing Cory’s blog and the regular commenters, Cory feels compelled to write this blog and I feel compelled to call it as I see it: Propaganda. Cory has said the blog is not news, he uses facts to argue his opinion but isn’t attempting to give the full picture. The commenters know this and come every day to lap it up. They love their own biases as we all do. But we’re supposed to be willing to look for deeper truths if we are skeptics. My criticism of Cory is he is an atheist, but not a skeptic, cause he doesn’t doubt his own opinions enough. He’s too certain he’s right all the time as are some of the commenters.
There’s no free speech on a private blog if he doesn’t want me to say what I say he will cut me off. Till then, and I hope that doesn’t happen, I say argue on.
Lighten up, Happy. Even Drumpf loves him some Muslims. They’d be the ones you might not want in your neighborhood, but Drumpf espouses different values for every minute in office.
http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2017/04/20/trump-does-love-some-muslims-the-autocrats-and-dictators.html
Remember during the election how Drumpf swore he would renegotiate the Iran Nukular deal because it was garbage? Wingnuts were all against it and decided to tell Iran they were going to change things when Obama was out of office.
Well even Drumpf is satisfied that that Iran is in full compiiance. This is a better deal than wingnuts had any reason to expect and you have seen from Drumpf’s inability to walk and chew gum he would have screwed up what actual statesmen had wrought.
Mike, I hate the normal stuff: killers and people who cut other people’s vagina. If fools want to believe in god, well, they’re fools and should be subjected to free speech. Did you watch that last link I kind of did that for you. Blast from the past.
I know I’m hard on Cory, but he’s a smart guy, and smart guys need peer review. If you’re only surrounded by adoring fans, not good, doubt is critical. It’s proven scientists love their own theories and need checks and balances.
According to The Guardian, leading public health researchers writing in the American Journal of Public Health, found 64 percent don’t support guns on college campuses, places of worship, government buildings, schools, bars and sports venues.
Mr. camper, you provide an appreciated service to us all.
happi-oh come on. u r so full of sheit, as always. I don’t know where to start. so, choose your last sentence. “It’s proven scientists love their own theories and need checks and balances.” you just make this sheit up in your Christian rage or whatever as you go along? https://www.nytimes.com/2017/04/20/world/canada/iceberg-ferryland-newfoundland.html
or go to the other side of the world. photo #5
http://www.livescience.com/57193-photos-antarctica-meltwater-lake.html
I welcome peer review… and I am happy to use the term “peer” to describe Hap.
Two-thirds of Americans support gun limits in public places – study https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2017/apr/20/gun-control-restrictions-schools-campuses-churches-stadiums
Cory, your PS regarding the story from the Daily Caller implicating the Vatican in a vast left-wing conspiracy to transform America into a Muslim dominated country was interesting to me. I saw the story on Facebook and it was ironic to me that a good right-wing Catholic shared the story without apparently noting its indictment of the Vatican. I guess if one is busy spreading hysteria about Muslims, one may overlook the affronts to Second Amendment rights and the Vatican.
Darin, in the past when Kurt Evans made glancing comments against the Catholic Church, Pat Powers, Troy Jones, and others have leapt on that anti-Catholic sentiment as cause for outrage. Their silence on this aspect of the story is as telling as Pat’s and others’ retreat from the Second Amendment in favor of stirring Islamophobia.
And so it appears Captain Ehab has been arrested for making a terrorist threat. That and the meth found in his house will pretty much get his CC license/permit pulled.
Meth—yeah, that’ll do it.
I look forward to reading the official complaint and determining if the state is now prepared to arrest and charge with making terroristic threats every idiot who waves a gun on Facebook.
KELO.com’s report on the arrest and the meth and firearms seized at the house:
http://kelo.com/news/articles/2017/apr/21/sioux-falls-facebook-ranter-arrested-and-charged/
Happy Camper has got to be doing a happy dance.
I’m A Muslim Reformer. Why Am I Being Smeared as an ‘Anti-Muslim Extremist’?
I am a brown, liberal, reform Muslim. I have survived violent neo-Nazi racism and served as a former War on Terror political prisoner in Egypt, witnessing torture. Yet, in a trip that takes us through the looking glass, the largely white American non-Muslim “progressive” leadership at the pro-civil liberties group Southern Poverty Law Center (SLPC) has just published a “journalist’s field list” naming me as an “anti-Muslim” extremist.
It’s not as if there’s any shortage of Muslim extremists who want me dead. They exist in numbers so plenty that former jihadists have even taken to calling in to my live LBC radio show to confess to once having made plans to assassinate me. Europe has witnessed around 6,000 of our fellow Muslims leave to join ISIS. Here in Europe, amid jihadist assassinations and mass terror attacks planned with military precision, we truly are in the thick of it. Meanwhile, from the comforts of sweet Alabama comes this edict that liberal Muslims working to throw open a conversation around reforming Islam today are somehow to be deemed “anti-Muslim extremists.”
http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2016/10/29/i-m-a-muslim-reformer-why-am-i-being-smeared-as-an-anti-muslim-extremist.html
Ah, I long for the days pre 2003, when we of the Coalition of the Willing, US and lackeys, went to war against Muslims. We of the COW, even declared this to be a “Crusade” to enlighten the Muslims. We of the COW even sent a man with a suit to Iraq to convince the good folk there to just say yes to the gift of our oil under their sand. Alas, they declined. And here we are.
We shake our heads in befuddlement as to why there are so many Muslims in Europe and why they come there. That is because we mostly have failed being taught the history of Western Civilization that shows the colonization of the very places these folks come from. Algeria, Syria, Morocco, the list goes on. Yep, we Americans too have our own cross to bear so to speak in how we have also used Imperialism as a way to subjugate the Muslim people. I say that for the most part, we have been more than willing participants in what Colin Powell described as “you break it, you own it”. Thanks Republicans for all these years of chaos. And now, you whinny little girlie girls, these folks are armed legally. How safe do you all feel now? Hey, I know, lets do the concealed deal again. Where is the NRA to bail in for support? How about Ted Nogent, Geezer Rock, where are they to defend the legal carry of weapons? Now to see this on the reservations makes more sense than ever before. South Dakota bed wetters are so terrified of openly armed Indians, that this would probably be a good time for that as well to show the stupidity of it all. Get a grip and get along. Find common ground without threat, stop the hate.
How could an embarrassed right wing law enforcement group faced with a disgruntled, wrongly accused and discriminated against citizen displaying his second amendment rights react? Hmmmm. Go in and confiscate the weapons? Nope. Too many pissed off gun huggers would defend his right to own more guns than is sensible. Go in and arrest him for terrorism? Maybe but the implications might cause a reactionary jihad against Sioux Falls by Muslim defense groups, worldwide. How about … charge him with terrorism but plant some meth in the house thus causing a “squirrel” moment where the focus is misdirected. Ahhhhh. That’s worked in the past with Native Americans. Let’s do it again.
(Isn’t it feasable that if 400 or so angry citizens had hate group meetings over and over denouncing Catholic Priests as child rapists eventually a disgruntled, wrongly accused and discriminated against Catholic man would react the same way?) PS … Brannon Howse is now trying to deflect his portion of the blame to the local cops.
I’m reading a book The 6th Extinction. It wasn’t until almost 1800 that mankind began to even accept the concept of extinction, they thought all animals that were alive, were still alive. Well, there were smart, high-IQ guys way back then just like Cory. Think if they never doubted, and left room for doubt in all their theories and views (as any strong ideology leads people to do). We’ve moved ahead because we are always doubting and reproving, there’s a danger in hunkering down with like-minded people that share your own biases, and in starting every argument only with the facts and opinions suiting mutual views. Even Thomas Jefferson was sure we were going to find the Mastodons. Fair and Balanced is essential and a good phrase even if it has been abused by Fox News.
Off to Breitbart. They know everything over there!
http://www.atlasobscura.com/articles/thomas-jefferson-built-this-country-on-mastodons
Come on happy, what is your solution that addresses the fear you feel and are attempting to spread about Muslims? Interment camps? Wars? Executions? Prisons?
What changes in American public policy are you hoping to support by trying to convince readers to fear 2.2 billion people who have been raised in or have converted to the Muslim religion?
Jefferson was correct! Here is a Mastodon that was killed by hunters 13,000 years ago in Michigan. http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-3847534/Ice-Age-beast-Michigan-13-000-year-old-mastodon-one-complete-discovered.html Jefferson would have been proud of himself.
I think the only thing Muslims want is to be left alone. What right do we in the west have to derail their wish?
Excellent question bear, exactly what do these anti-Muslims groups want?
Do they want to deport 1st, 2nd, and 3rd generation Muslims?
Do they want to legally ban Islam and burn the Mosques?
Whatever it is they want, the seem afraid to say it out loud.
Hi, Jerry and Roger. Good to hear what y’all have to say. It’s always pertinent and on top of the situation. Thanks. A question? What do these anti-Muslim hate groups want? Who cares what they want but I do care what they need, as that’s where the danger lies. They need a place that won’t tar and feather their happy asses for being radical hate mongers.
~South Dakota has long been a haven for hate groups. In the 60’s the hate was against African Americans. Then Native Americans. Then Mexican Americans. Now Muslim Americans. If you’ve never lived elsewhere you can’t realize how SoDak differs from normal places. It’s time to admit that South Dakota’s people are the problem not the hated group of the moment. That’s the only way to get back on track. White supremacists bring their hate of the month club to SoDak in particular because it’s tolerated. I remember my teenage daughter seeing an anti-women’s rights billboard. “That would get burned down in one night if it was back home in Colorado.” she said. Cory stands up against these hate groups and he’s labeled the enemy.
Thanks Porter. I think the first thing to address is why South Dakota folks hate. To me, it is simple, the hate is bought on by fear. The people in South Dakota are poor, very poor. The report that was posted in Dakota Free Press about the actual take home of ag people is accurate and alarming. These folks are basically share croppers that work the ground owned by special interests like banking and insurance companies. The majority have 2nd and third jobs to keep the lights on. These folks have to have someone to blame for their lack of advancement as well as their future. They blame their conceived view of “poor” as not being like them. They blame the Mexicans and other immigrants as taking the fourth job they need to make their lives better. They also go to church for the most part and they believe that other religions than their own are also doing them no good deed. And now the Muslim. They only see those as darkies. They do not see the Muslims of the Balkans nor of other Muslims that are whiter than them. They see the bearded darkie that chops off the heads.
I am always amused at the great links of hyperbole these haters go to give them the idea that they are right in what they perceive as logic. We have posters here that do the same with Catholics, Jews and so on. There has to be a reason for their lack of progress, their news programs tell them that all is well and that the reasoning is simple, it is caused by the immigrants and by religions not their own. South Dakota politicos have understood this since they figured out how badly the voters were getting screwed by their legislative ineptness. If you bring up God, guns, darkies and abortion, ignorant people will vote you in every time. Also, South Dakota was one of the last great land treaty thefts from the Indians. The people who came here in the early days had no place else to go, this was it. Their hate of the dark skinned people is out of the fear that one day some judge is gonna say, boys, this land was stolen, your gonna have to give it all back. Talk about a motivator, I would get you a sawbuck that if you went to one of these “Christian” hate meetings and you mentioned support of Indians, you would get an earful of hate that would make you blush.
Hey Porter, it is nice to see you back in action.
As many of you know, I am Native American and was raised on the Pine Ridge Reservation and have lived in Rapid City for nearly 30 years.
On thing I learned at an early age was that some people I didn’t know hated me.
In my near 70 years nothing has really changed except some of the faces.
You are right, many South Dakotans just need to hate and don’t really need an excuse, it seems to be in their DNA and passed down from generation to generation.
For the longest time I thought their hate was fear or fear of the unknown, now I believe it is hate for the sake of hating.
The greatest loss for the haters is that they don’t get to experience the diversity of other cultures and traditions, they have shutdown their learning and closed their hearts.
You guys are really smart people. I was going to bring up the simple minded fear that drives the hate but as usual if I think of something that is worth saying on DFP and just wait a short time, one of the Masters of Dakota here say it much better than I ever could. Why raise your kids in a “Certified Hate State”? You tell me, South Dakota. I’ll just listen and learn.
No, not masters at all Porter, just observers, in my view. Many posters, you included, offer so much to the conversation that it is an educational joy to read them.
Now I hate to break up this Love Fest, but this is Confirmation Bias Magnified: I think just like up do, you’re so smart. No, you think just like I do, you’re so smart. No, we’re all so smart cause we all think the same. Love and Kisses!
Love ‘ya, sweetie. Got a guy? ❤️
happy camper, you’re just trying to be clever, sad. bcb asks a question, I will print it in its entirety “Come on happy, what is your solution that addresses the fear you feel and are attempting to spread about Muslims? Interment camps? Wars? Executions? Prisons?
What changes in American public policy are you hoping to support by trying to convince readers to fear 2.2 billion people who have been raised in or have converted to the Muslim religion?”
One of the things that seem to get your panties in an uproar is not being able to answer directly a simple question. bcb brings a direct legitimate question into the mix and you ignore it while instead, trail off in some hissy fit of feigned rage that you cannot seem to help yourself with. No, we all do not think the same. Thankfully, we are all a part of a site that does not just cater to a one thought process
The question stands, what is your answer/solution to bcb’s question?
I have been consistent. There is Political Islam (Radical Islam, Islamists), this extreme minority that forms groups like ISIS, the ones that use Mohammed’s early example to expand power, dominate and eliminate minorities, the actual terrorists.
Then there is Fundamentalist Islam, which still takes the religion very seriously, women have to wear the hijab, forced marriage, female genital mutilation, etc. Things that are actually happening here in the U.S.
Then there are Peace Loving Muslims, the religion is part of their culture, but they are very rational people.
Denial of the first two, pretending they don’t exist is the most damaging. Openness, free speech, this raises consciousness, not shutting people down as xenophobes because they have fears and concerns of the first two categories.
We are not afraid of 2.2 million people, we are afraid of the radicals, and uncompromising with those who desire or are willing to transform our liberal culture to accommodate illiberal values.
Happy,
Do you ever intend to answer Bear’s question, if not why don’t you just say so.
I just did. Talk about it openly.
Of course, you mean hate groups in the United States, Christian ones http://time.com/4671800/hate-groups-on-the-rise/
Of course, you also mean Fundamentalist Christian groups, http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2237728/The-shocking-truth-life-inside-Warren-Jeffs-FLDS-Members-tell-believe-cult-leader-U-S-President-15-men-responsible-fathering-ALL-children.html One of many interesting Christian groups that operate safely and freely in South Dakota as well as the rest of the country. This one makes a living off of fraud, a good one too.
I have tried my arse off and cannot see how these groups are liberals. I also have tried to see how these groups of thousands embrace your life style, sorry happy, it looks like being gay is not conducive to any of these groups of people. Don’t be afraid, be cognitive of those around you. If you think they are out to get you, you are not paranoid, you are probably correct.
Now you’re throwing bombs. You asked what should we do differently about the Muslim question, my response is we should talk openly about how various groups interpret Islam.
No bombs other than truth bombs. As noted in the links, what is the difference (regarding homosexuality, women etc.) between any of these groups? As I think we are discussing your particular fears of Islam as a homosexual, how is it any different than the rest?
Speaking of truth bombs, here is one that was on Muslim extremists http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-39664212 Turns out, it was a capitalist looking to game the system. Can it be finally said that this type of speculation is what trump was doing with the 59 Tomahawk missiles, just upping the stock price of Raytheon for personal gain?
My position is not specific to my sexuality. If the left starts being honest that Radical Islam is a threat and Fundamentalist Islam cannot be tolerated, then rational policies will simply develop, but currently, anyone who wants to discuss either of these is blasted an Islamaphobe.
The Democrats lost because they couldn’t even confront the issues and the right or whatever you want to call Trump (La Pen and others) has filled the void.
You are all over the map happy. The Muslims that are refugees are vetted for upwards of 2 years sir. Do you not think that those that vet are capable of ascertaining a threat to this country? The left is not a problem anymore than the right is regarding this issue. What it comes down to is professionalism by those whose job it is to do the vetting. Radical Islam is like just like Timothy McVeigh. Fundamentalist Islam is just like Fundamentalist Crooks and liars that steal from their willing dummies in their congregations. No use for any of them. My church is what I see, my beliefs are what I feel and my fear is the hope that I never intentionally wrong those that are trusting in my judgements. Get a grip son, no one has filled a void that has not been manipulated by business interests. The great god of money cares only about how much you are willing to spend. Religion means nothing more than that, just the money. Don’t be afraid, swipe your card. trump and le pen are both just lying grifters. Do you know how you can tell when they lie? Me either, as they never speak the truth, ever.
Me, I will stand with whomever I feel makes the most sense. My guess it will be those that tend to trend towards being unassigned to any religion. Holy rollers of any faith bore me and I have little if any tolerance towards them.
happy, if I understand your more recent position, you say that you do not fear all Muslims, rather, you only fear “Radical Islam . . . and Fundamentalist Islam.” And to alleviate this fear you contend that “Fundamentalist Islam cannot be tolerated.”
You told Roger that the answer to my earlier question is to “talk about it openly.” But what is it you hope to accomplish by talking about it openly (which you have been doing for quite some time now)? Are you satisfied simply trying to inculcate fear and hatred in your friends, family, and neighbors by demonizing the people you consider radicals or fundamentalists? Your call for “rational policies” seems to seek more than a forum to simply “talk about it.”
What do you see as “rational policies” that would eliminate both radical and fundamentalist Islam? Summary executions? Executions only after a trial to determine the religious beliefs of the accused? New wars against countries that permit these religious views, perhaps using nuclear weapons or MOAB’s in an effort to eradicate everyone in such countries who might share the incorrect religious beliefs? Interment camps where those with the wrong religious viewpoints are isolated from society?
Since “talking about it openly” apparently has not brought you any relief, what “rational policies” do you advocate to quell your extreme fear of these humans who follow religious practices you disagree with?