Deutsch, a Watertown chiropractor, is also a Republican State Representative. He says, in response to the Planned Parenthood abortion videos, he plans to introduce a bill in Pierre to restrict the sale of unborn body parts in South Dakota. Deutsch says it’s a preventative bill as there is no evidence that such sales have happened in the state. Deutsch believes even some pro-choice state lawmakers would support his bill since it does not restrict abortion itself [Mark Russo, “South Dakota Abortion Foe Shares His Plans,” KELO-AM Radio, 2015.09.07].
“Preventative bill”—code for “Not actually a problem, but better for Republican campaign rhetoric than focusing on K-12 funding.”
Consider the example of Planned Parenthood. Lawmakers are calling for a government shutdown unless federal funds for Planned Parenthood are stripped from spending bills for the fiscal year starting October 1st. Why? Because Planned Parenthood provides fetal tissue samples from abortions to scientific researchers hoping to cure diseases, from Alzheimer’s to cancer. (Storing and safeguarding that tissue requires resources, and Planned Parenthood charges researchers for the costs.) It’s clear that many of the people protesting Planned Parenthood are opposed to abortion on religious grounds and are, to varying degrees, anti-science. Should this cause scientists to clam up at the risk of further offending or alienating them? Or should we speak out loudly to point out that, independent of one’s beliefs about what is sacred, this tissue would otherwise be thrown away, even though it could help improve and save lives? [Lawrence M. Krauss, “All Scientists Should Be Militant Atheists,” The New Yorker, 2015.09.08]
Never mind that putting fetal tissue samples to good use is more moral than throwing them in the garbage. Never mind that the deceptive videos Rep. Deutsch and his GOP colleagues will hyperventilate about come January were put-up jobs manipulated well beyond any reliability. The SDGOP has points to score and issues to avoid.
Rich women have full reproductive freedom while women at middle and lower income levels experience chilling effects on their rights. South Dakota’s repeated attempts to restrict access to medical care is not only mean-spirited, it’s discriminatory anti-choice extremism.
Loren
2015-09-09 08:27
What is it with the Republican party? Always presenting a solution in search of a problem! Prevent the sale of body parts that is not happening. Drug test public assistance folks for drugs they are not taking. Prevent voter fraud that is nonexistent. The Benghazi boogey man! The fictitious war on Christianity! On and on and on… And you think it will be better under President TRUMP???? Geez!
jerry
2015-09-09 09:07
How do these complete asses like Fred get elected? I am thinking Larry is correct, we deserve the scum we send to Pierre. The goof is probably good at one thing though, being able to take a bribe like the rest of the cabal in Pierre.
Jana
2015-09-09 11:14
Fred’s bill should be called the “Ban Dr. Ben Carson in South Dakota” bill as it would make him a criminal to do the type of research he has done in the past using fetal tissue.
Hey all. Fred is a good guy and an education advocate. In my years in the legislature I didn’t bring one pro-life bill. Why? Because SD has already done the heavy lifting in the bills that are presently being litigated and the end game of that will be the reversal of Roe v. Wade. The Supreme Court has reversed itself over 230 times in the past. Roe v Wade is soooo 1973. Science tells us today when human life begins and three in ten post-abortive women say abortion hurt them. Imagine 3:10 odds in any other health care matter for women – it’s Russian roulette. It’s probably more than 3:10 because denial is a safe place for so long.
We know Planned Parenthood covers up sex crimes against minors, aborts the evidence and sends the girl back into the hands of her creepy uncle or whomever. We know Planned Parenthood is about eugenics and, black genocide is a fact. We know they’ve never renounced their overt racist origins and practices. And now they sell human body parts and cut the faces of living babies to extract their brains. These are just facts. The respectability facade Planned Parenthood has enjoyed has crumbled. There are many other places for women to get healthcare in South Dakota. South Dakota will be just fine without them.
mikeyc, that's me!
2015-09-09 12:06
Sigh…..
larry kurtz
2015-09-09 12:14
Are all chiropractors criminals and nutjobs or just the Republican, catholic ones? Scott Munsterman groped at least one teen, Fred Deutsch wants to end women’s civil rights and Allen Unruh wants to rewrite history.
Think of it as the Bill Cosby Effect: the more sanctimonious the speech the more cash gets raised to hide career criminal behavior.
Turn your head and cough.
Ron
2015-09-09 12:21
The most defenseless of all cast aside so easily – so much for the right to life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. Apparently, those approving of abortions have convinced themselves what is in the womb is either not human or alive. I would like to think that anyway because the alternative is pure evil.
That’s not “the” alternative, Ron. I am not evil. I can acknowledge that there is a living creature in the womb. Yet I assign overriding value to the rights and autonomy of the women within whose womb that creature lives; thus; I refuse to require that woman to submit her body to the service of that living creature. It’s not as easy to say as “We love babies!” but it is the proper response for a government that must give women equal status with men.
That said, Larry’s initial statement is accurate. Abortion restrictions and the general effort to push Planned Parenthood out of South Dakota drive greater inequality between rich and poor. Planned Parenthood does important work for women’s health. The religious right needs to get off Planned Parenthood’s back. I would vote against Deutsch’s proposed legislation, to make clear that Planned Parenthood is an important health care provider and that the premise upon which Deutsch and SDRTL is basing this legislative push is false.
Bob Newland
2015-09-09 13:51
Hickey? You still infecting the cyberways with your crap? Thought you were in Scotland or somewheres.
As for Deutsch, et al, get ready for another season of ISIS in Pierre, led by the likes of Phil Jensen, Brock Greenfield, Jenna Haggar, Lance Russell, and other remnants of the Ted Klaudt faction.
I just reread Hickey’s post. Now THAT is totally off the rails. Maybe there IS a god; Hickey is out of the legislature.
mike from iowa
2015-09-09 14:48
On a side note,PP moved their flagship clinic from near the WH to a building they purchased in 2013-next to a charter school. Parents are rightly concerned their young kids will be bombarded with explicit aborted fetus signs and nasty language. Maybe this is one way t6o shut protesters down or at least force them to be polite and civil.
Deb Geelsdottir
2015-09-09 14:50
“We know” Hickey does very good work on issues of poverty and struggling people. When it comes to a woman’s rights to control her own body as a full and autonomous human being, “we know” Hickey makes up stuff.
It’s kind of weird really. Hickey seems to really get it about Jesus’ overarching theme, but then comes women’s basic rights and BOOM! Off the rails he goes. Bizarre.
jerry
2015-09-09 14:55
Deb, if Hickey really gave a care, he would have supported the Medicaid Expansion for poverty and struggling people. The Rev. did a good thing with the payday loans and now I will have to lower my voice because it would seem I shall be silent after that on the good he has done to outweigh the bad. I just wonder when Marty is gonna go to Scotland and bring him back here for the petition stuff.
Deb Geelsdottir
2015-09-09 15:02
” the good he has done to outweigh the bad.”
Jerry, I don’t look at it that way. Hickey has done some good things and I applaud him for that.
– AND –
He lies about Planned Parenthood.
Maybe he actually thinks what he’s heard somewhere is true, I don’t know. Either way, both things are there and one does not zero out the other.
bearcreekbat
2015-09-09 15:05
Hickey, it gets even worse. Do you realize that surgical units actually cut people open? And to make matters worse, those units that engage in so-called “transplant” medicine rip open dead bodies and literally tear the parts out that they can then sell to people needing transplants. Imagine, some poor deceased person having the corneas cut out of his or her eyes, or having a heart ripped out just to be given to someone else, or even having their very face ripped off now that these evil doctors are doing face transplants. And you wouldn’t believe it, but these doctors and surgical units charge real fees for tearing apart the bodies of the dead.
It gets worse. Under the guise of “helping” a patient they will cut the bodies of living human being open, sometime even amputating limbs.
Let’s all hope that Rep. Deutsch expands his bill to stop doctors, hospitals and surgical units from cutting up dead people and taking their body parts and then selling these parts to people needing transplants.
JeniW
2015-09-09 15:20
Too bad that there is not seem to be has much legislative support toward preventing unintentional/unwanted conceptions.
MC
2015-09-09 15:30
JeniW, that would be the very best way to stop abortions. Do you have any ideas; besides traditional family values which seems to be rejected by this group?
larry kurtz
2015-09-09 15:41
Nothing says bipartisanship like denying women their civil rights and rejecting blended families: right, Clark?
mike from iowa
2015-09-09 16:00
Traditional family values-my wife and my gawd forgave me so I’m good to go. However,Bill Clinton just had to be impeached for doing what us family values guys do and we get away with it because our voters are so damn dumb! Personal responsibility is for dopey Libs.
SDBlue
2015-09-09 16:39
I am a rabid women’s rights advocate. This legislation makes as much sense as the ban on sex-selective abortions our legislature passed last session. With all the problems our state faces (i.e. 1 in 5 bridges deemed structurally deficient, education and teacher wages in the tank, four of the top ten poorest counties in the nation, etc.), the powers that be here would rather concentrate on fake videos released by a fake company, all in the name of treating women as if they cannot make reproductive decisions for themselves. They thump their bible, demand we all follow their self-righteous religious ways and not a single one of them understands the difference between religious ideals and civil law. This is nothing but further proof that South Dakota Republicans are just as stupid as the Republicans at the national level.
larry kurtz
2015-09-09 16:46
Compared with other Spanish women of childbearing age, women who got abortions were 15 times less likely to have used IUDs, vasectomy, or tubal ligation. Birth control hadn’t failed in Spain. Inferior birth control had failed. The best birth control had worked.
while bcb is making a point, i can tell you, speaking for nearly every person who has lost a loved one and consented to organ, ect. donorship, the surgical people who handle the request in such a beautiful way, often during an intense time of grief; that we are only too happy to say “yes” and gain great strength and healing from the mere act.
leslie
2015-09-09 17:05
while bcb is making a point, i can tell you, speaking for nearly every person who has lost a loved one and consented to organ, ect. donorship, the surgical people handle the request in such a beautiful way, often during an intense time of grief, that we are only too happy to say “yes” and gain great strength and healing from the mere act.
Jay Sekulow is getting rich representing outhits like the one with the PP videos.
Spencer
2015-09-09 17:25
I am glad for the sake of some on this blog that their mothers never donated a supposedly mysterious clump of cells, you, to an abortionist/fetal parts harvesting operation. Thankfully, her Christian values did not run off the rails when she encountered life versus abortion. It is easy to take one’s life for granted and deny it for others.
bearcreekbat
2015-09-09 17:25
leslie, I fully agree with you and was only trying to get Hickey to see how silly his histrionic comments are. Using descriptions of medical procedures to create some sort of horror movie image is nothing more than a cheap tactic aimed at undermining a woman’s right to control what happens inside her own body.
I am an organ donor and hope that someone can be helped or science advanced using whatever is left of my body. My sincere apologies if my comment created any distress for you.
Bill Napoli and Spencer Cody are breeders who believe some medical procedures should be reserved for white christian women who have been saving themselves for future husbands but who were brutally impregnated by non-white men.
South Dakota: Land of Infinite Vendettas.
Bob Newland
2015-09-09 17:36
Thank Dog the mothers of Adolph Hitler, Josef Stalin, Ted Klaudt and Mike Verchio chose life instead of doing the right thing.
leslie
2015-09-09 17:39
absolutely not, bcb-i knew where you were coming from:) Sadly ( i hate that, its so sibby and many other conservative posters here), but sadly Spencer, our decorated science teacher, chose here to chime in and show that BENGAZI and the Planned Parenthood ploy, are Republican tactics right up there with 2008-12 economic recovery obstructionism, that are over his educated head.
mike from iowa
2015-09-09 17:47
Spencer,what makes you think we are all christians or come from christian parents? I was like a puppy and became a Liberal the moment my eyes opened.
Spencer
2015-09-09 17:51
So, liberals are in favor of the death penalty as long as people are tried for future crimes in utero? That sounds like a good plot for a Twilight Zone episode. I’m sure we can think of something inventive to justify it.
SDBlue
2015-09-09 18:08
@Spencer, my birth and schooling predates Roe v. Wade. I remember high school classmates who became pregnant while their churches preached abstinence only. Using “the pill” was labeled as an excuse for women to be “loose”. The girls were shamed and called slut and whore behind their backs. But the boy who knocked them up? Usually a jock who everyone felt sorry for because now that he has the responsibility of being a father, his chances of an athletic career are over. Women have been treated as second-class citizens for generations. The Religious Right’s perpetual obsession with a woman’s vagina is nothing more than their attempt at continuing that treatment.
Deb Geelsdottir
2015-09-09 19:03
Spencer, if you’re going to force women to surrender control of their bodies upon becoming pregnant, what is your plan to take control of the impregnator’s body?
Bearcreekbat, you just wrote the speech that some brave Democratic Representative needs to deliver when Deutsch’s bill reaches the floor. Or if we can’t find a legislator, perhaps you and I can testify at the committee hearing in full Colbert Report mode (can we use that reference now that he’s himself on CBS?).
MC, at what point did I give you the impression that I have forsaken traditional family values? What specific comment in my original post or in the comments preceding your question give you that impression about the other participants in this discussion?
In my family, truth is a value. My family rejects lies about Planned Parenthood.
In my family, respect and equality for women is a value. My family rejects legislative attempts to take respect and equality away from women.
To your question: our aim is not to stop abortions. I will go so far as to say that abortion, as a medical procedure that involves introducing drugs or foreign objects into the body, is unpleasant and, like most other medical procedures, should be avoided if possible. But sometimes, it needs to happen. More importantly, sometimes, women will choose to make it happen, and the government cannot make that choice for them (or stop them from making it).
The state has no compelling interest in stopping any or all abortions. Can we even make the case for a compelling state interest in reducing abortions? The state isn’t paying for them, so what’s the state’s angle?
But if we acknowledge some sort of social goal to reduce the number of abortions, then, as JeniW says, we need to reduce the number of unplanned/unwanted pregnancies. The most reliable way to reduce unplanned/unwanted pregnancy is affordable long-acting reversible contraceptives. Educating young people on how to use all contraceptives properly helps, too. Planned Parenthood can make both of those things happen. Defunding Planned Parenthood (read the name of the organization again!) runs counter to the goal of reducing unplanned/unwanted pregnancies.
That explanation isn’t as emotionally satisfying as shouting, “I’m stopping you heathens from killing babies and selling their parts!” But it’s how things work, and it’s how we protect the equal rights of women through science.
Spencer! False dilemma! Our support for Planned Parenthood and birth control does not mean that we are wishing our mothers had not conceived us. Nor does our advocacy here mean that, when we beat Deutsch’s bill and protect Planned Parenthood, every woman in America will rush out and have an abortion and cause humanity to die out. Not every woman is going to choose to abort every conceived fetus. But someone will will choose to abort some fetuses, and they have that right. They have found ways to do so for eons, yet the human population has exploded. Abortion never has and never will. We’re far more likely to do ourselves in with war, environmental degradation, and ignorance of the science that might save our keesters. What is South Dakota Right to Life doing to fight those far greater threats to the lives of far more present and future blog commenters?
Jana
2015-09-09 19:44
Pastor Hickey, while I respect you and your beliefs no matter how much we disagree, your position that there are plenty of places where women can get the 97% of services so necessary and life saving is patently false if you are looking at what it would cost them.
What does an office visit cost at your family physician vs. Planned Parenthood?
With it’s advocacy, accessibility and affordability PP serves so many women and families. If they go away how many more unwanted/unplanned pregnancies will occur? How many more will be added to our poorest and least cared for? How many will die without the benefit of affordable, accessible and preventative female reproductive health care?
owen reitzel
2015-09-09 20:26
“We know Planned Parenthood covers up sex crimes against minors, aborts the evidence and sends the girl back into the hands of her creepy uncle or whomever. We know Planned Parenthood is about eugenics and, black genocide is a fact.”
You have proof of this statement Rev. Hickey?
MC
2015-09-09 21:34
Cory, I did not mention you specifically, however, when the idea of a traditional nuclear family is mentioned there is a backlash in the comments.
When it comes to defunding PP. I want more information. The videos are pretty damning evidence, but, I get the feeling they are not telling the whole story. Where they haggling over the price of parts, or where discussing storage and transportation costs. What ever the case, Planned Parent deserves a much closer look.
There is one word that can stop unwanted/unexpected pregnancies. RESPECT. We need to learn to respect each other and their relationships.
If you’re looking an inexpensive way to stop pregnancies, abstinence works 100% it is tried, and very easy to reverse it is very cheap.
I do not oppose traditional nuclear families. I don’t think traditional nuclear families are a bad idea. But families don’t have to look like Ward, June, Wally, and the Beaver to do what families should do.
The videos are not damning evidence. Read the links above explaining that they are so manipulated that they could not be admitted in a court of law as evidence. Plus, even the manipulated material, obtained under false pretenses, provides no evidence that anyone at Planned Parenthood was violating the law, and it catches no one saying to the video fakers, “Yeah, we’ll sell you some baby parts, hand us some cash and here you go.” That would be damning, and that didn’t happen.
Abstinence doesn’t even work among the religious right. Abstinence-only is not responsible public policy. Against one of the most powerful and de-rationalizing forces in the human psyche, we need a backup plan. Birth control is that plan.
I could say we could stop almost every social ill with one word, RESPECT: murder, drug abuse, human trafficking, income inequality, petty theft… but we can’t build public policy on that platitude. No social contract in human history has ever said, “We’ll just all respect each other, and everything will be fine.” I’m a liberal, but I’m not a utopian. I know we need more than one word to maintain a healthy society.
But why don’t I turn the platitude? Why don’t I tell South Dakota Right to Life to get off its authoritarian horse and accept that we can solve the problem it sees with one word, RESPECT? Quit trying to legislate your sexual morality; focus on preaching directly to young women to respect themselves and their bodies and not have sex until marriage (that’s what y’all would say, right?). Preach directly to young men to respect women, accept that only Yes means yes, and only act on that Yes with the woman who wears one’s ring. If RESPECT will solve everything, then SDRTL should get the heck out of my Legislature and let us work on the budget.
Jenny
2015-09-09 21:55
Are all these people that are fighting for these fetuses willing to pay higher taxes in order to support them when they are out of the womb? Or perhaps they could adopt a couple of these young ‘uns and pay for their medical care. At risk minority babies with lots of medical complications will be most in need of loving homes.
Nick Nemec
2015-09-09 22:38
If the pro-life crowd really wants to reduce the incidence of abortion they should support mandatory sex ed and free contraception. But that’s not going to happen.
Jenny
2015-09-09 22:40
Also, why are the Right to Life people and SD GOP legislators and Gov Daugaard against Medicaid expansion? Are the thousands of SD children needing Medicaid of any less value than the fetuses they’re worried about?
jana
2015-09-09 22:51
MC, abstinence is effective, but how realistic do you think it is?
Spencer
2015-09-09 22:55
Cory, you are skewing SDRTL’s purpose and mission. SDRTL in reality only spends a small fraction of its resources and time on legislation and lobbying. Far more effort and emphasis is placed on the very issues you mention concerning respect through pro-life and pro-woman education on the local chapter level.
Ken A
2015-09-10 00:37
There’s one thing you’ll aways find in S. Dakota, and that’s hypocritical Republican politicians. Another thing you’ll find are the MORONS who keep electing these hacks time after time, then stupidly sit back and wonder why they’re getting screwed over again.
This state is sooooo backward! If the Republican hacks in Pierre don’t like a vote of the people, they simply ignore the outcome and do what they damn well please. And what do the people say about this? Not one damn thing. They have NO brains, and NO backbones. They’ll accept anything Republicans shovel their way, and what they usually get is what belongs in the sewer to begin with.
The Stupid here doesn’t burn. It incinerates.
Porter Lansing
2015-09-10 04:17
As merely a Catholic wedge issue, it’s still just an invalid attempt by dysfunctional authoritarian males to stand on the necks of “mother figures” they’ve never been able to control.
Baloney, Spencer. You elect a sitting legislator as your president, and one of the first actions that new president announces is new legislation to attack Planned Parenthood and promote your war against science. That tells me your group is spending too much time trying to impose its religiously-based views through law rather than persuasion.
Furthermore, let’s look at the mission statement on the SDRTL.org front page. I bold the text that appears to support my point about SDRTL’s overfocus on legislative action:
SDRTL’s primary purpose is to educate through the presentation of detailed and factual information about fetal development, abortion, alternatives to abortion, infanticide, euthanasia, and related issues, upon which individuals and the general public may make informed decisions. SDRTL supports a Human Life Amendment to the U.S. Constitution to make possible legal protection of all human beings and educated citizens to take constructive citizen action to protect the most basic human right – LIFE itself.
The legal protection of the right to life of innocent human beings is the basic issue upon which all other issues of human rights and justice depend. It is the pivotal human rights issue today, because once we abandon the basic democratic principle of equality – that ALL human beings deserve the protection of the law no matter what their size, their age or their degree of dependency then the rights of all of us are less secure [South Dakota Right to Life, “Mission Statement,” SDRTL.org, downloaded 2015.09.10].
The emphasis in that statement appears to be almost entirely on “legal protection,” most specifically in the form of a Constitutional amendment. The “general public” doesn’t decide whether or not to have an abortion; the general public votes for candidates and laws. I don’t need to skew the exact words that SDRTL uses: this mission statement says SDRTL’s focus is legislation.
Bob Newland
2015-09-10 10:41
Lynn? You still lurking? Whatcha gotta say ’bout this?
JeniW
2015-09-10 11:53
MC – I have ideas but they would be D.O.A. by the legislators.
Jana
2015-09-10 18:26
Pastor Hickey, you do know that pre-Roe v. Wade that abortions were readily available for the wealthy.
Here’s some data on how many women without wealth rely on PP for reproductive and other health concerns that are not met by the other organizations you are counting on.
If this ridiculous bill is even entertained, South Dakota will once again make National news for our “crazy politics”—imagine Phil Jensen will be happy to co-sponsor!!
Jana, great link. Permit me to quote at length from it:
In 2010, 36 percent of the 6.7 million U.S. women receiving contraceptive care from safety-net family planning health centers were served at Planned Parenthood centers. And there are some areas of the country where women rely particularly heavily on Planned Parenthood: In 18 states, Planned Parenthood health centers serve more than 40 percent of women obtaining contraceptive care from a safety-net family planning health center. In 11 of those 18 states, Planned Parenthood serves more than half the women obtaining contraceptive care from a safety-net health center.
In 68 percent of counties with a Planned Parenthood site (332 counties out of 491), these sites serve at least half the women obtaining publicly supported contraceptive services from a safety-net health center. And in 21 percent of counties with a Planned Parenthood site (103 counties), Planned Parenthood serves all of the women obtaining publicly supported contraceptive services from a safety-net health center [Jennifer Frost and Kinsey Hannsett, “Quantifying Planned Parenthood’s Critical Role in Meeting the Need for Publicly Supported Contraceptive Care,” Health Affairs Blog, 2015.09.08].
2.4 million women getting contraceptive services from Planned Parenthood. Tens of thousands of them having no other providers of such services in their county. Shut down Planned Parenthood, and tens of thousands of women would be at greater risk of unplanned/unwanted pregnancy… which is what MC and I seem to agree we want to prevent.
Kim, I agree. Can you help me get Independents to keep Deutsch’s bill in mind and come to the polls in November to replace him and his colleagues with less embarrassing legislators?
Deb Geelsdottir
2015-09-10 22:09
Cory, what a low bar to raise. SD needs “less embarrassing legislators.” The saddest part is how true that is.
“My fellow District 4-ians! I promise to be less embarrassing than our current representatives! I promise to pass fewer bad laws! I promise to spend less time distracted from the budget! Vote for me, and Jimmy Fallon and Stephen Colbert will tell 50% fewer jokes about us. Blush less—vote for me!”
I’m going to need to contract out to South DaCola or some other qualified cartoonists to accurately visualize this campaign theme….
Dana P
2015-09-11 11:35
I’m trying to decide what is worse. A propaganda driven organization that edits video/audio tapes to put out misleading information to the public? (That the SDRL/Deusch is exploiting for purely political reasons) Or, Pastor Hickey/ex-legislator Hickey (amongst many others) that actually try to propel their “arguments” based on lies and misinformation? And said pastors/legislators who continually perpetuate lies and misinformation? And citing statistics that well…..were pulled out of thin air. (Mr Hickey, I’m familiar with several women that have had abortions – that were very glad that their rights and freedom to make decisions about reproductive health care was there for them. And it had nothing to do with their creepy uncle, or whatever.)
Sad that Mr Hickey wants to hoot and holler about Roe v Wade being overturned, and do a pre victory —- victory dance. Never apologizing for being happy about wanting to take away freedoms that women (and men!) should have about their family planning and healthcare. And all during Mr Hickey’s propaganda post, did I not see one thing in support of putting things together to PREVENT unwanted pregnancies in the first place.
Mr Hickey, while you are doing your victory dance, please review the history of Romania and how their communist dictator —– oh, I mean, leader —- decided to “outlaw” abortion in their country and the horrific aftermaths of making it illegal. And then, look how the amount of abortions actually DECREASED when abortion was made LEGAL after their leader was no longer in power (post 1990). Now those are facts, and not just propaganda.
I would hate to see the United States head down the path that Romania did……but wow, it looks like “we” are trying to do just that. And our state legislators need to stop doing the opposite of what the people in this state (TWICE – in this case) have told them not to do.
Bob Newland
2015-09-11 12:00
Don’t jerk and legislate.
Deb Geelsdottir
2015-09-11 17:32
Good comment Dana.
I’m still waiting for Hickey’s description of the actions that will be taken against the impregnators. I think I’ll be waiting a long time because Hickey has apparently become one of those Hit & Run commenters. He pops in, makes a ridiculous comment, then runs, not responding to questions and rebuttals. He might say he’s too busy, but he wasn’t too busy to write his initial comment. I think I’m not the only one is very disappointed in his Hit & Run behavior.
Bob Newland
2015-09-11 17:50
That’s been my experience with Hickey also, Deb. He tries to come across as a little hipper than your average preacher, pretends he really considers your point of view, then delivers some ludicrous representation of fact or opinion, then refuses to engage after he sees you’re going to attempt to make him rely on some semblance of empirical evidence. He then chalks it up to the questioner being queer or just naturally afflicted with Satan. I have more distaste for his type than I do for, say, Brock Greenfield or the Phat Phough over at WarCollege, who are right up front with their desire to make the law punish those who are not being punished enough–in their opinions–by God.
Porter Lansing
2015-09-11 18:05
There’s a name for men who need to control women. It’s a well documented psychological malady that’s manifest often in those with an authority complex. (cops, politicians, ministers) Flight instructors say these are the hardest to teach because they don’t listen to reason.
mike from iowa
2015-09-11 18:44
Wingnuts have known for years that these videos are heavily edited to misrepresent facts and they don’t care. They just want to further their agenda no matter the costs.
MC
2015-09-11 21:03
I’m not saying defund Planned Parenthood permanently. All I’m saying let’s take a closer look at what is going on. If everything is on the up and up, and the only thing that is being charged is storage and transportation, restore the funding, and let them go on their merry way. If it found they were or are selling embryos or their parts for profit, charge the people involved, remove them, and set up a process to make sure it doesn’t happen again; then restore funding and off they go again.
Respect will fix alot of problems, I have agree we need laws to keep everyone honest and doing the right thing.
JeniW I would like to hear what ideas you have.
Deb Geelsdottir
2015-09-11 22:00
MC, Planned Parenthood actually loses a little money on tissue per the president of PP MN/Dakotas. It’s probably more accurate to say that PP charges preparation and shipping fees, but the bozos who created that propaganda piece wanted language that was much more distorted, provocative and inflammatory.
Deb Geelsdottir
2015-09-11 22:01
Yes Bob, I can see that you’re right about Hickey. Too bad.
MC, why suspend their funding when there is no reliable evidence they have done anything wrong and plenty of evidence that they are providing enormous social good?
MC
2015-09-12 09:17
Suspend or don’t suspend, it doesn’t really matter. What should happen is this issue be investigated. If there is nothing there, then drive on. If there is some thing wrong, let’s work through the legal system and deal with it.
Dana P
2015-09-12 09:33
MC….multiple investigations in multiple states have already been conducted (since the doctored tapes have been released), and the findings? There has been no wrong doing in any of these cases. And by the way, in Florida, Gov Scott had an investigation initiated of Florida PP’s – and he tried to suppress the findings of the investigations that showed no wrong doing. Now why in the heck would he do that?
The complete and undoctored tapes have been viewed by many people. And every single PP representative on the “full” tapes discuss this in great detail, and actually show that they are not breaking the law. Very clearly. Now why in the heck would those portions have been cut out and not shown to the general public in the first place?
These folks have had these tapes/interviews for almost a year. If they really were concerned that there was “law breaking” and horrible things being done……why wait so long for the release? They didn’t take their supposed evidence to the Department of Justice or any other type of law enforcement – at any time during that year?
mike from iowa
2015-09-12 09:46
How many times are wingnuts gonna fall for the “cry wolf” non-sense before they finally get that there is no there there? They are still trying to find evidence of crimes about Benghazi after nearly a dozen investigations and studies and zero evidence that Obama and Clinton did anything wrong.
Fiscally responsible(lol) wingnuts wasted millions of dollars because they have subpoena power and too damn much free time on their hands. Kill ’em all or at least vote them out.
South Dakota deserves the legislature it suffers.
Rich women have full reproductive freedom while women at middle and lower income levels experience chilling effects on their rights. South Dakota’s repeated attempts to restrict access to medical care is not only mean-spirited, it’s discriminatory anti-choice extremism.
What is it with the Republican party? Always presenting a solution in search of a problem! Prevent the sale of body parts that is not happening. Drug test public assistance folks for drugs they are not taking. Prevent voter fraud that is nonexistent. The Benghazi boogey man! The fictitious war on Christianity! On and on and on… And you think it will be better under President TRUMP???? Geez!
How do these complete asses like Fred get elected? I am thinking Larry is correct, we deserve the scum we send to Pierre. The goof is probably good at one thing though, being able to take a bribe like the rest of the cabal in Pierre.
Fred’s bill should be called the “Ban Dr. Ben Carson in South Dakota” bill as it would make him a criminal to do the type of research he has done in the past using fetal tissue.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/post-politics/wp/2015/08/13/ben-carson-no-apologies-for-1992-fetal-tissue-research/
Hey all. Fred is a good guy and an education advocate. In my years in the legislature I didn’t bring one pro-life bill. Why? Because SD has already done the heavy lifting in the bills that are presently being litigated and the end game of that will be the reversal of Roe v. Wade. The Supreme Court has reversed itself over 230 times in the past. Roe v Wade is soooo 1973. Science tells us today when human life begins and three in ten post-abortive women say abortion hurt them. Imagine 3:10 odds in any other health care matter for women – it’s Russian roulette. It’s probably more than 3:10 because denial is a safe place for so long.
We know Planned Parenthood covers up sex crimes against minors, aborts the evidence and sends the girl back into the hands of her creepy uncle or whomever. We know Planned Parenthood is about eugenics and, black genocide is a fact. We know they’ve never renounced their overt racist origins and practices. And now they sell human body parts and cut the faces of living babies to extract their brains. These are just facts. The respectability facade Planned Parenthood has enjoyed has crumbled. There are many other places for women to get healthcare in South Dakota. South Dakota will be just fine without them.
Sigh…..
Are all chiropractors criminals and nutjobs or just the Republican, catholic ones? Scott Munsterman groped at least one teen, Fred Deutsch wants to end women’s civil rights and Allen Unruh wants to rewrite history.
Think of it as the Bill Cosby Effect: the more sanctimonious the speech the more cash gets raised to hide career criminal behavior.
Turn your head and cough.
The most defenseless of all cast aside so easily – so much for the right to life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. Apparently, those approving of abortions have convinced themselves what is in the womb is either not human or alive. I would like to think that anyway because the alternative is pure evil.
That’s not “the” alternative, Ron. I am not evil. I can acknowledge that there is a living creature in the womb. Yet I assign overriding value to the rights and autonomy of the women within whose womb that creature lives; thus; I refuse to require that woman to submit her body to the service of that living creature. It’s not as easy to say as “We love babies!” but it is the proper response for a government that must give women equal status with men.
Similarly, Fred’s not a complete ass. He’s pretty smart, and he bicycles avidly. He just happens to be wrong on this issue.
Related: Ellsworth drone pilots and the illusion of the “Good Kill.”
That said, Larry’s initial statement is accurate. Abortion restrictions and the general effort to push Planned Parenthood out of South Dakota drive greater inequality between rich and poor. Planned Parenthood does important work for women’s health. The religious right needs to get off Planned Parenthood’s back. I would vote against Deutsch’s proposed legislation, to make clear that Planned Parenthood is an important health care provider and that the premise upon which Deutsch and SDRTL is basing this legislative push is false.
Hickey? You still infecting the cyberways with your crap? Thought you were in Scotland or somewheres.
As for Deutsch, et al, get ready for another season of ISIS in Pierre, led by the likes of Phil Jensen, Brock Greenfield, Jenna Haggar, Lance Russell, and other remnants of the Ted Klaudt faction.
I just reread Hickey’s post. Now THAT is totally off the rails. Maybe there IS a god; Hickey is out of the legislature.
On a side note,PP moved their flagship clinic from near the WH to a building they purchased in 2013-next to a charter school. Parents are rightly concerned their young kids will be bombarded with explicit aborted fetus signs and nasty language. Maybe this is one way t6o shut protesters down or at least force them to be polite and civil.
“We know” Hickey does very good work on issues of poverty and struggling people. When it comes to a woman’s rights to control her own body as a full and autonomous human being, “we know” Hickey makes up stuff.
It’s kind of weird really. Hickey seems to really get it about Jesus’ overarching theme, but then comes women’s basic rights and BOOM! Off the rails he goes. Bizarre.
Deb, if Hickey really gave a care, he would have supported the Medicaid Expansion for poverty and struggling people. The Rev. did a good thing with the payday loans and now I will have to lower my voice because it would seem I shall be silent after that on the good he has done to outweigh the bad. I just wonder when Marty is gonna go to Scotland and bring him back here for the petition stuff.
” the good he has done to outweigh the bad.”
Jerry, I don’t look at it that way. Hickey has done some good things and I applaud him for that.
– AND –
He lies about Planned Parenthood.
Maybe he actually thinks what he’s heard somewhere is true, I don’t know. Either way, both things are there and one does not zero out the other.
Hickey, it gets even worse. Do you realize that surgical units actually cut people open? And to make matters worse, those units that engage in so-called “transplant” medicine rip open dead bodies and literally tear the parts out that they can then sell to people needing transplants. Imagine, some poor deceased person having the corneas cut out of his or her eyes, or having a heart ripped out just to be given to someone else, or even having their very face ripped off now that these evil doctors are doing face transplants. And you wouldn’t believe it, but these doctors and surgical units charge real fees for tearing apart the bodies of the dead.
It gets worse. Under the guise of “helping” a patient they will cut the bodies of living human being open, sometime even amputating limbs.
Let’s all hope that Rep. Deutsch expands his bill to stop doctors, hospitals and surgical units from cutting up dead people and taking their body parts and then selling these parts to people needing transplants.
Too bad that there is not seem to be has much legislative support toward preventing unintentional/unwanted conceptions.
JeniW, that would be the very best way to stop abortions. Do you have any ideas; besides traditional family values which seems to be rejected by this group?
Nothing says bipartisanship like denying women their civil rights and rejecting blended families: right, Clark?
Traditional family values-my wife and my gawd forgave me so I’m good to go. However,Bill Clinton just had to be impeached for doing what us family values guys do and we get away with it because our voters are so damn dumb! Personal responsibility is for dopey Libs.
I am a rabid women’s rights advocate. This legislation makes as much sense as the ban on sex-selective abortions our legislature passed last session. With all the problems our state faces (i.e. 1 in 5 bridges deemed structurally deficient, education and teacher wages in the tank, four of the top ten poorest counties in the nation, etc.), the powers that be here would rather concentrate on fake videos released by a fake company, all in the name of treating women as if they cannot make reproductive decisions for themselves. They thump their bible, demand we all follow their self-righteous religious ways and not a single one of them understands the difference between religious ideals and civil law. This is nothing but further proof that South Dakota Republicans are just as stupid as the Republicans at the national level.
http://www.slate.com/articles/health_and_science/medical_examiner/2015/09/contraception_abortion_and_planned_parenthood_debate_long_acting_birth_control.html
while bcb is making a point, i can tell you, speaking for nearly every person who has lost a loved one and consented to organ, ect. donorship, the surgical people who handle the request in such a beautiful way, often during an intense time of grief; that we are only too happy to say “yes” and gain great strength and healing from the mere act.
while bcb is making a point, i can tell you, speaking for nearly every person who has lost a loved one and consented to organ, ect. donorship, the surgical people handle the request in such a beautiful way, often during an intense time of grief, that we are only too happy to say “yes” and gain great strength and healing from the mere act.
http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2015/09/09/how-to-get-rich-suing-the-government-for-jesus.html
Jay Sekulow is getting rich representing outhits like the one with the PP videos.
I am glad for the sake of some on this blog that their mothers never donated a supposedly mysterious clump of cells, you, to an abortionist/fetal parts harvesting operation. Thankfully, her Christian values did not run off the rails when she encountered life versus abortion. It is easy to take one’s life for granted and deny it for others.
leslie, I fully agree with you and was only trying to get Hickey to see how silly his histrionic comments are. Using descriptions of medical procedures to create some sort of horror movie image is nothing more than a cheap tactic aimed at undermining a woman’s right to control what happens inside her own body.
I am an organ donor and hope that someone can be helped or science advanced using whatever is left of my body. My sincere apologies if my comment created any distress for you.
Ooooo: the white christian defending his breeder rights. http://www.sdrighttolife.org/?author=2
Bill Napoli and Spencer Cody are breeders who believe some medical procedures should be reserved for white christian women who have been saving themselves for future husbands but who were brutally impregnated by non-white men.
South Dakota: Land of Infinite Vendettas.
Thank Dog the mothers of Adolph Hitler, Josef Stalin, Ted Klaudt and Mike Verchio chose life instead of doing the right thing.
absolutely not, bcb-i knew where you were coming from:) Sadly ( i hate that, its so sibby and many other conservative posters here), but sadly Spencer, our decorated science teacher, chose here to chime in and show that BENGAZI and the Planned Parenthood ploy, are Republican tactics right up there with 2008-12 economic recovery obstructionism, that are over his educated head.
Spencer,what makes you think we are all christians or come from christian parents? I was like a puppy and became a Liberal the moment my eyes opened.
So, liberals are in favor of the death penalty as long as people are tried for future crimes in utero? That sounds like a good plot for a Twilight Zone episode. I’m sure we can think of something inventive to justify it.
@Spencer, my birth and schooling predates Roe v. Wade. I remember high school classmates who became pregnant while their churches preached abstinence only. Using “the pill” was labeled as an excuse for women to be “loose”. The girls were shamed and called slut and whore behind their backs. But the boy who knocked them up? Usually a jock who everyone felt sorry for because now that he has the responsibility of being a father, his chances of an athletic career are over. Women have been treated as second-class citizens for generations. The Religious Right’s perpetual obsession with a woman’s vagina is nothing more than their attempt at continuing that treatment.
Spencer, if you’re going to force women to surrender control of their bodies upon becoming pregnant, what is your plan to take control of the impregnator’s body?
Bearcreekbat, you just wrote the speech that some brave Democratic Representative needs to deliver when Deutsch’s bill reaches the floor. Or if we can’t find a legislator, perhaps you and I can testify at the committee hearing in full Colbert Report mode (can we use that reference now that he’s himself on CBS?).
MC, at what point did I give you the impression that I have forsaken traditional family values? What specific comment in my original post or in the comments preceding your question give you that impression about the other participants in this discussion?
In my family, truth is a value. My family rejects lies about Planned Parenthood.
In my family, respect and equality for women is a value. My family rejects legislative attempts to take respect and equality away from women.
To your question: our aim is not to stop abortions. I will go so far as to say that abortion, as a medical procedure that involves introducing drugs or foreign objects into the body, is unpleasant and, like most other medical procedures, should be avoided if possible. But sometimes, it needs to happen. More importantly, sometimes, women will choose to make it happen, and the government cannot make that choice for them (or stop them from making it).
The state has no compelling interest in stopping any or all abortions. Can we even make the case for a compelling state interest in reducing abortions? The state isn’t paying for them, so what’s the state’s angle?
But if we acknowledge some sort of social goal to reduce the number of abortions, then, as JeniW says, we need to reduce the number of unplanned/unwanted pregnancies. The most reliable way to reduce unplanned/unwanted pregnancy is affordable long-acting reversible contraceptives. Educating young people on how to use all contraceptives properly helps, too. Planned Parenthood can make both of those things happen. Defunding Planned Parenthood (read the name of the organization again!) runs counter to the goal of reducing unplanned/unwanted pregnancies.
That explanation isn’t as emotionally satisfying as shouting, “I’m stopping you heathens from killing babies and selling their parts!” But it’s how things work, and it’s how we protect the equal rights of women through science.
Spencer! False dilemma! Our support for Planned Parenthood and birth control does not mean that we are wishing our mothers had not conceived us. Nor does our advocacy here mean that, when we beat Deutsch’s bill and protect Planned Parenthood, every woman in America will rush out and have an abortion and cause humanity to die out. Not every woman is going to choose to abort every conceived fetus. But someone will will choose to abort some fetuses, and they have that right. They have found ways to do so for eons, yet the human population has exploded. Abortion never has and never will. We’re far more likely to do ourselves in with war, environmental degradation, and ignorance of the science that might save our keesters. What is South Dakota Right to Life doing to fight those far greater threats to the lives of far more present and future blog commenters?
Pastor Hickey, while I respect you and your beliefs no matter how much we disagree, your position that there are plenty of places where women can get the 97% of services so necessary and life saving is patently false if you are looking at what it would cost them.
What does an office visit cost at your family physician vs. Planned Parenthood?
With it’s advocacy, accessibility and affordability PP serves so many women and families. If they go away how many more unwanted/unplanned pregnancies will occur? How many more will be added to our poorest and least cared for? How many will die without the benefit of affordable, accessible and preventative female reproductive health care?
“We know Planned Parenthood covers up sex crimes against minors, aborts the evidence and sends the girl back into the hands of her creepy uncle or whomever. We know Planned Parenthood is about eugenics and, black genocide is a fact.”
You have proof of this statement Rev. Hickey?
Cory, I did not mention you specifically, however, when the idea of a traditional nuclear family is mentioned there is a backlash in the comments.
When it comes to defunding PP. I want more information. The videos are pretty damning evidence, but, I get the feeling they are not telling the whole story. Where they haggling over the price of parts, or where discussing storage and transportation costs. What ever the case, Planned Parent deserves a much closer look.
There is one word that can stop unwanted/unexpected pregnancies. RESPECT. We need to learn to respect each other and their relationships.
If you’re looking an inexpensive way to stop pregnancies, abstinence works 100% it is tried, and very easy to reverse it is very cheap.
I do not oppose traditional nuclear families. I don’t think traditional nuclear families are a bad idea. But families don’t have to look like Ward, June, Wally, and the Beaver to do what families should do.
The videos are not damning evidence. Read the links above explaining that they are so manipulated that they could not be admitted in a court of law as evidence. Plus, even the manipulated material, obtained under false pretenses, provides no evidence that anyone at Planned Parenthood was violating the law, and it catches no one saying to the video fakers, “Yeah, we’ll sell you some baby parts, hand us some cash and here you go.” That would be damning, and that didn’t happen.
Abstinence doesn’t even work among the religious right. Abstinence-only is not responsible public policy. Against one of the most powerful and de-rationalizing forces in the human psyche, we need a backup plan. Birth control is that plan.
I could say we could stop almost every social ill with one word, RESPECT: murder, drug abuse, human trafficking, income inequality, petty theft… but we can’t build public policy on that platitude. No social contract in human history has ever said, “We’ll just all respect each other, and everything will be fine.” I’m a liberal, but I’m not a utopian. I know we need more than one word to maintain a healthy society.
But why don’t I turn the platitude? Why don’t I tell South Dakota Right to Life to get off its authoritarian horse and accept that we can solve the problem it sees with one word, RESPECT? Quit trying to legislate your sexual morality; focus on preaching directly to young women to respect themselves and their bodies and not have sex until marriage (that’s what y’all would say, right?). Preach directly to young men to respect women, accept that only Yes means yes, and only act on that Yes with the woman who wears one’s ring. If RESPECT will solve everything, then SDRTL should get the heck out of my Legislature and let us work on the budget.
Are all these people that are fighting for these fetuses willing to pay higher taxes in order to support them when they are out of the womb? Or perhaps they could adopt a couple of these young ‘uns and pay for their medical care. At risk minority babies with lots of medical complications will be most in need of loving homes.
If the pro-life crowd really wants to reduce the incidence of abortion they should support mandatory sex ed and free contraception. But that’s not going to happen.
Also, why are the Right to Life people and SD GOP legislators and Gov Daugaard against Medicaid expansion? Are the thousands of SD children needing Medicaid of any less value than the fetuses they’re worried about?
MC, abstinence is effective, but how realistic do you think it is?
Cory, you are skewing SDRTL’s purpose and mission. SDRTL in reality only spends a small fraction of its resources and time on legislation and lobbying. Far more effort and emphasis is placed on the very issues you mention concerning respect through pro-life and pro-woman education on the local chapter level.
There’s one thing you’ll aways find in S. Dakota, and that’s hypocritical Republican politicians. Another thing you’ll find are the MORONS who keep electing these hacks time after time, then stupidly sit back and wonder why they’re getting screwed over again.
This state is sooooo backward! If the Republican hacks in Pierre don’t like a vote of the people, they simply ignore the outcome and do what they damn well please. And what do the people say about this? Not one damn thing. They have NO brains, and NO backbones. They’ll accept anything Republicans shovel their way, and what they usually get is what belongs in the sewer to begin with.
The Stupid here doesn’t burn. It incinerates.
As merely a Catholic wedge issue, it’s still just an invalid attempt by dysfunctional authoritarian males to stand on the necks of “mother figures” they’ve never been able to control.
Baloney, Spencer. You elect a sitting legislator as your president, and one of the first actions that new president announces is new legislation to attack Planned Parenthood and promote your war against science. That tells me your group is spending too much time trying to impose its religiously-based views through law rather than persuasion.
Furthermore, let’s look at the mission statement on the SDRTL.org front page. I bold the text that appears to support my point about SDRTL’s overfocus on legislative action:
The emphasis in that statement appears to be almost entirely on “legal protection,” most specifically in the form of a Constitutional amendment. The “general public” doesn’t decide whether or not to have an abortion; the general public votes for candidates and laws. I don’t need to skew the exact words that SDRTL uses: this mission statement says SDRTL’s focus is legislation.
Lynn? You still lurking? Whatcha gotta say ’bout this?
MC – I have ideas but they would be D.O.A. by the legislators.
Pastor Hickey, you do know that pre-Roe v. Wade that abortions were readily available for the wealthy.
Here’s some data on how many women without wealth rely on PP for reproductive and other health concerns that are not met by the other organizations you are counting on.
http://healthaffairs.org/blog/2015/09/08/quantifying-planned-parenthoods-critical-role-in-meeting-the-need-for-publicly-supported-contraceptive-care/
If this ridiculous bill is even entertained, South Dakota will once again make National news for our “crazy politics”—imagine Phil Jensen will be happy to co-sponsor!!
Jana, great link. Permit me to quote at length from it:
2.4 million women getting contraceptive services from Planned Parenthood. Tens of thousands of them having no other providers of such services in their county. Shut down Planned Parenthood, and tens of thousands of women would be at greater risk of unplanned/unwanted pregnancy… which is what MC and I seem to agree we want to prevent.
Kim, I agree. Can you help me get Independents to keep Deutsch’s bill in mind and come to the polls in November to replace him and his colleagues with less embarrassing legislators?
Cory, what a low bar to raise. SD needs “less embarrassing legislators.” The saddest part is how true that is.
Deb, imagine the stump speech:
“My fellow District 4-ians! I promise to be less embarrassing than our current representatives! I promise to pass fewer bad laws! I promise to spend less time distracted from the budget! Vote for me, and Jimmy Fallon and Stephen Colbert will tell 50% fewer jokes about us. Blush less—vote for me!”
Hahahahahahahaha!
Here’s your slogan: “Blush less—vote for me!”
What about a logo?
I’m going to need to contract out to South DaCola or some other qualified cartoonists to accurately visualize this campaign theme….
I’m trying to decide what is worse. A propaganda driven organization that edits video/audio tapes to put out misleading information to the public? (That the SDRL/Deusch is exploiting for purely political reasons) Or, Pastor Hickey/ex-legislator Hickey (amongst many others) that actually try to propel their “arguments” based on lies and misinformation? And said pastors/legislators who continually perpetuate lies and misinformation? And citing statistics that well…..were pulled out of thin air. (Mr Hickey, I’m familiar with several women that have had abortions – that were very glad that their rights and freedom to make decisions about reproductive health care was there for them. And it had nothing to do with their creepy uncle, or whatever.)
Sad that Mr Hickey wants to hoot and holler about Roe v Wade being overturned, and do a pre victory —- victory dance. Never apologizing for being happy about wanting to take away freedoms that women (and men!) should have about their family planning and healthcare. And all during Mr Hickey’s propaganda post, did I not see one thing in support of putting things together to PREVENT unwanted pregnancies in the first place.
Mr Hickey, while you are doing your victory dance, please review the history of Romania and how their communist dictator —– oh, I mean, leader —- decided to “outlaw” abortion in their country and the horrific aftermaths of making it illegal. And then, look how the amount of abortions actually DECREASED when abortion was made LEGAL after their leader was no longer in power (post 1990). Now those are facts, and not just propaganda.
I would hate to see the United States head down the path that Romania did……but wow, it looks like “we” are trying to do just that. And our state legislators need to stop doing the opposite of what the people in this state (TWICE – in this case) have told them not to do.
Don’t jerk and legislate.
Good comment Dana.
I’m still waiting for Hickey’s description of the actions that will be taken against the impregnators. I think I’ll be waiting a long time because Hickey has apparently become one of those Hit & Run commenters. He pops in, makes a ridiculous comment, then runs, not responding to questions and rebuttals. He might say he’s too busy, but he wasn’t too busy to write his initial comment. I think I’m not the only one is very disappointed in his Hit & Run behavior.
That’s been my experience with Hickey also, Deb. He tries to come across as a little hipper than your average preacher, pretends he really considers your point of view, then delivers some ludicrous representation of fact or opinion, then refuses to engage after he sees you’re going to attempt to make him rely on some semblance of empirical evidence. He then chalks it up to the questioner being queer or just naturally afflicted with Satan. I have more distaste for his type than I do for, say, Brock Greenfield or the Phat Phough over at WarCollege, who are right up front with their desire to make the law punish those who are not being punished enough–in their opinions–by God.
There’s a name for men who need to control women. It’s a well documented psychological malady that’s manifest often in those with an authority complex. (cops, politicians, ministers) Flight instructors say these are the hardest to teach because they don’t listen to reason.
Wingnuts have known for years that these videos are heavily edited to misrepresent facts and they don’t care. They just want to further their agenda no matter the costs.
I’m not saying defund Planned Parenthood permanently. All I’m saying let’s take a closer look at what is going on. If everything is on the up and up, and the only thing that is being charged is storage and transportation, restore the funding, and let them go on their merry way. If it found they were or are selling embryos or their parts for profit, charge the people involved, remove them, and set up a process to make sure it doesn’t happen again; then restore funding and off they go again.
Respect will fix alot of problems, I have agree we need laws to keep everyone honest and doing the right thing.
JeniW I would like to hear what ideas you have.
MC, Planned Parenthood actually loses a little money on tissue per the president of PP MN/Dakotas. It’s probably more accurate to say that PP charges preparation and shipping fees, but the bozos who created that propaganda piece wanted language that was much more distorted, provocative and inflammatory.
Yes Bob, I can see that you’re right about Hickey. Too bad.
MC, why suspend their funding when there is no reliable evidence they have done anything wrong and plenty of evidence that they are providing enormous social good?
Suspend or don’t suspend, it doesn’t really matter. What should happen is this issue be investigated. If there is nothing there, then drive on. If there is some thing wrong, let’s work through the legal system and deal with it.
MC….multiple investigations in multiple states have already been conducted (since the doctored tapes have been released), and the findings? There has been no wrong doing in any of these cases. And by the way, in Florida, Gov Scott had an investigation initiated of Florida PP’s – and he tried to suppress the findings of the investigations that showed no wrong doing. Now why in the heck would he do that?
The complete and undoctored tapes have been viewed by many people. And every single PP representative on the “full” tapes discuss this in great detail, and actually show that they are not breaking the law. Very clearly. Now why in the heck would those portions have been cut out and not shown to the general public in the first place?
These folks have had these tapes/interviews for almost a year. If they really were concerned that there was “law breaking” and horrible things being done……why wait so long for the release? They didn’t take their supposed evidence to the Department of Justice or any other type of law enforcement – at any time during that year?
How many times are wingnuts gonna fall for the “cry wolf” non-sense before they finally get that there is no there there? They are still trying to find evidence of crimes about Benghazi after nearly a dozen investigations and studies and zero evidence that Obama and Clinton did anything wrong.
Fiscally responsible(lol) wingnuts wasted millions of dollars because they have subpoena power and too damn much free time on their hands. Kill ’em all or at least vote them out.
http://www.esquire.com/news-politics/politics/news/a37572/bobby-jindal/
Major syphillis out break in New Orleans and Jindal wants to fight outbreak by defunding Planned Parenthood. Neither clinic in La performs abortions.